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Yale Medical School To Residency w/ Sofia
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Welcome to MedKinza talks your go to source for bite sized content and becoming future doctors. I'm your host, Kinza Hussain, and I'm a second year medical student helping students navigate the ins and outs of one of the most competitive careers. I will be sharing the lessons I've learned and inviting guest speakers to provide real quality advice to help you get into medical school, succeed as a med student and prepare you to become a future doctor. Want more free quality advice? Subscribe to my YouTube channel and follow me on Instagram @medkinza, where I post videos and infographics delivering content to you every week. Now sit back, relax and learn something new. And don't forget to subscribe so you don't miss any of my latest episodes. Released every week.
Hey, welcome. This is Episode 17 in this episode, I have the pleasure of interviewing Sophia, who is a fourth year medical student at Yale. I have been a long term follower of her Instagram account @thisgirlnamedsohia who puts a lot of great fashion content with empowering captions.
Sophia really uses her platform to spread knowledge and raises her voice against the common injustices of the world. She is also a co-host of a podcast called Red, White and Brown, where they discuss the struggles of being first-generation immigrants from South Asia in the US. I'm so excited to ask her more about her journey, her stats and what applying to residency has been looking like. Hi, Sophia, thank you so much for joining me today. I'm really excited to have you on the episode. How are you?
Good. Thank you so much for having me. Excited to be here.
Of course, I know you're talking a little bit earlier, but I've been following your account for like the past two to three years has been really awesome to kind of see your platform grow and then finally have the opportunity to speak a little bit more.
Well, thank you so much. You’ve definitely been around since the early days then.
I think I joined when maybe your second year at Yale? But has your experience been like you? How have you like the last four years now that you're almost done?
Yeah, it's been really good. So I don't think we discussed this, but I'm in my fourth year. But it's a research year, so I am I still have one more year basically because I'll be applying next cycle, OK. But yeah, the light at the end of the tunnel is, you know, it's there.
So I've been hearing a lot more people say that they're doing a research year. Go ahead and tell us a little bit about yourself, your background and where you're from, what you're doing and how everything's going.
Yeah, definitely. So I am a Pakistani American. I was born and raised in Chicago. I grew up in the city. So like in the city of Chicago, not like a nearby suburb. The way sometimes people sometimes people from like Skokie or like Naperville will say they're from Chicago. But I am truly from Chicago. F
I’m from Boston. But I'm from a suburb.
Yeah. So you know what I mean. Yeah, I'm from the city. I attended public school my entire life and I graduated high school in 2013 and then went off to Princeton for college where I majored in public policy. But obviously I was also premed and then I graduated in twenty seventeen and I started med school here at Yale. So I didn't take any time off between undergrad and med school. And I'm currently as I mentioned in it's my fourth consecutive year, but it's a third year. So I'm not actually applying to residency yet. But so it's basically going to be a five year program for me. I'm in year four of five, but yeah. And then outside of school, I enjoy reading, listening to podcasts, working on the podcast that my classmate and I started and obviously also enjoy fashion. I love like DIY and surfing and all of that. And then I also enjoy cooking.
That's awesome. We have a lot of similar interests then. I don't have this as a written question, but I kind of want to delve into a little bit more about why you decided to do research year, how you kind of made that decision for yourself?
Yeah, definitely. So one thing I will say is I know every school kind of approaches it differently and it's much more common at some schools than other schools. So at Yale, it is actually very common to do a research year. I think probably 80 percent of my class is doing it. At the time of interviewing, that was actually something that they emphasized very heavily, that we encourage research, we're really into scholarship. And you're going to have the opportunity to do a research year here if you want to, like everyone has the opportunity. So that was like a big part of, I think, Yale and their system and they really encourage it. So given that that was like sort of the baseline and like so many people were doing it, I think it makes it easier to pursue that path because I think at a lot of other places, it's if you're doing a research year, you're probably in the minority. And any time you're doing something different, that makes it a little bit tougher, right? Yeah. So I think that's one thing. I'll say the other. Just with COVID this year, obviously has thrown things off for everyone, and so I was originally actually not planning to do a research year. I was just going to go straight through. I had done my sub internships, got my letters of recommendation. A lot of stuff was actually in place, like a lot of that legwork to apply as I've already done it. But I hadn't taken a step two. And part of that is because Yale does things differently where we do our clinical year and then you take step one and step two back to back. So, yeah, yeah, it's different.
It's definitely different. And so, yeah, I was I took step one earlier this year as a fourth-year medical student. I did step one and then just yeah. Step two is still on the agenda. But I think things were feeling a little bit rushed just because I would have to basically be applying to residency and taking step two at the same time and also working on my thesis. And I'm going to be totally honest with I was feeling like, yeah, things were just rushed and I didn't think I would have enough time to devote to my thesis and do like a really stellar job. And so I was just like, you know what? It is so common to take this extra year that I should just do it when I was an undergrad. We also everyone at Princeton is required to do a thesis. And so I was like interviewing for med school while also taking classes and doing my thesis at the same time. And at the end of it, my thesis wasn't something I was super proud of just because that was kind of the last priority. Right. Priority number one is like getting into med school at that time. So I didn't want the same thing to happen again this time where I could kind of tell it was going in that direction. And so I was my ultimate decision was just like, you know what, let me take the year, do a good job on this thesis, maybe try to get like a couple of publications this year, and then I'll just strengthen my residency application altogether. And hopefully maybe the situation around covid will be a little bit more subtle next year. And like the process of applying to like it might, there might just be more clarity around it.
There was a lot of important stuff you said in there. So you realized you kind of rush things coming out of undergrad to just get into medical school and you rushed your thesis. Is your thesis required, by the way, for Yale too?
Yes. So it's just nice that you took a step back and you were like, it's OK if I take an extra year, I'm not going to rush into things again and I'm going to just perform quality work rather than just kind of go, go, go. I'm sure you're appreciating the subtle break that's kind of been as well.
Definitely.
I can’t imagine taking step one and two back to back either. That's just a lot of again. Go, go, go. Like no breaks.
Yeah.
So that's awesome. I want to talk about step back and talk about your premed days really quick with my next question. But coming out of Princeton must have taken your mcat probably around your junior year. It was probably set in stone around junior year to to apply and not take that gap year after college. If you don't mind sharing. What did your stats look like for applying?
Yeah, so I actually publicly never shared my stats. So and the reason the reason is because I feel like it's not like a helpful motivational story, like I don't have stats that are like super low that I can say like, oh, look, like you can get into med school with like lower stats like my stats were good. And also and also just because I think the schools they publish what their averages are. Right. So Yale's average and I think is a 520, and I had a 520 so that's it's just nothing like out of the ordinary.
And so I just don't feel like it's helpful or motivational. That's why I've never shared that my GPA at the time of applying, I genuinely I don't even remember I was somewhere between a three point seven and the 3.9, but what I will say is that I remember at the time when I was applying thinking that my GPA was on like kind of a lower end because again these schools publish their averages and right so to Yale’s averages of like 3.85 anything and so my GPA must have been below that and I just the reason I don't share like what it was is because I think it's misleading also so Princeton at the time was known for also having great deflation like along with our transcripts they would send a note saying that like only 30% of students are Allowed to receive an a grade like, you know what I mean? Like there was this policy of just like limiting the number of As and just you know, it was a well-known fact that like we had this great deflation policy that has since changed. I think the culture is still kind of the same where professors are not just like handing out A's but at the end yeah. Yeah. I know it's crazy and it makes it very difficult because likeIf I was surrounded by brilliant people and if only 30% can get an A like 70% the other 70% are still doing very well, you know, so it makes it challenging but our like health professionals advising office they had definitely warned us that like, you know, don't worry about like he's average GPA is like even if you have a little bit lower like schools will still take you because they know we have this policy. And so yeah, so my GPA is probably on the lower end of like what my my meds school class like gpas are and so yeah, that's part of the reason I don't share it is because like if I think if I was coming from another institution and I had the GPA I had I don't know if I would have gotten it like I think it's only okay because of where I was coming from and I'm not saying that's a good thing. I'm not saying that's a bad thing other schools also have this sort of policy. I know U Chicago has this policy or a similar like they're known for also having great deflation and You know, it's it is what it is. But I just yeah, that's kind of the reason I've been so reluctant, but it it was probably like I don't know like a 3.75 o or something like around there.
But no, you know what? I think I feel special that you were, you know comfortable enough sharing those numbers on the podcast today, but I think that's why I also ask that follow-up question as to like, what do you think really stood out in your application overall when you were applying to these schools because I know that there are people 'well that definitely their stats help them get in and those people that don't have those stats have something maybe really awesome on their application like extracurriculars or something about the hobbies that they do that helped them get in but I definitely think there were a lot of people I'm sure applying to Ivy medical schools with really high stats, right but not all of them got into Yale. So there still was something about your application. There's only I'm sure your class is relatively small maybe like 80 people.
Around there. Yeah, I think so thousands of applications coming in. So there's still something that you know makes you stand out that's different. So even if your stats are high and you don't have a special story like you think you don't have a special story, but there's still something there. That's gonna help people listening you like. Oh, like that's kind of like what she was doing on the side as well for her extracurriculars. Like this is her background, you know, you want sentences great school. It's a great thing when you're saying that probably helped you stand out with like the 3:7 GPA which is On the lower end of their average, but I would love to hear kind of more about what your extracurriculars look like or what do you think really stood out like what something that they talk to you a lot about maybe during your interview that you think helped you send out to.
I guess I do think that my application was probably like quote-onquote interesting because I did have a you know, a lot of them sort of basic like Hospital volunteering like research experience all of those things but then I mean I also wrote about like my interest in fashion and like just like fashion design and like I am really interested even just like designing and sewing my own clothes and you know, that's something I like. I think that was probably different. I do remember getting.
Yeah, like that's exactly those looking for because a lot of people aren't sure if they can share that kind of stuff on it. Med school application like like that's the one thing that's going to make you stand out so you should share with them.
Yeah, I totally agree. And I I mean even like for applying to undergrad I feel like my application was interesting. Like I really think like for anything I've gotten accepted to whether it's a school or like an internship or whatever else. I do think I've always liked that interesting candidate. I also definitely put a lot of work into like the essays on stuff and so my like the writing that I submitted was very good. Like I think it was probably above, you know, the sort of average essay that was that they were reading and I again when I say that I mean like it was just interesting right? Like I do think I was able to capture the reader's attention like even now when I go back and look at some of my essays but I'm like, yeah like this good like I I put a lot of work into this. And just revising drafts like 10-12 times just to really make sure that the writing was, you know, just captured exactly what I wanted to say. And I I also talked a lot about even I don't know just like cultural things. Like I wasn't shy to talk about like my background and my culture and like religion and like I don't know just like religious like philosophies. Things that have influenced me and I know sometimes people are reluctant to share especially like as a Muslim like a lot of people are like, oh, I don't really want to share that.
Yeah, I was like I had a good experience when you're an MSA with a speaker that we invited and I really struggled with like should I make this I wanted to make it my meaningful experience and I did end up doing that because it you know helped me grow a lot in certain ways, but I was definitely reluctant. I was not sure if I could do that.
Yeah. Yeah, I think a lot of people feel that way and like I think if you can talk about like your culture or religion or whatever. In an interesting way, I think definitely do it, you know it's and it's also not just like one person reading. You know what I mean? It's not just going to be one person who looks at your application and makes the decision. It's multiple people. So like the odds that you're gonna like offend someone there. I think they're pretty low, especially the schools to do value diversity. So yeah, I think just like my writing was good. I kind of included like these interesting tidbits here and there. The other thing I will say is I study public policy, which I think is not super uncommon because a lot of people focus on like Global health and like public health policy and stuff in undergrad and they talk about that when applying but my focus was not really on Healthcare was more sort of like I had a couple of experiences that were more like the counterterrorism like arena so it was just very different to anything or anyone writing about that. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So I think a lot of times people feel like they need to relate all of their activities back to medicine and and in some ways I think that's good. Like it's important to be able to draw parallels between like, you know, your extracurriculars and medicine but sometimes I also think it's okay to study something like totally separate. Because you're still gonna have your pre-med classes, right? So yeah, I think the more if you can Branch out and like study something else that's interesting and still do well and you know, the core pre-med classes then I think that's I think that's great like that. That is what makes candidates interesting think.
Yeah. No, that's great advice because I think I just learned something new to I've come to kind of been giving the advice that when people are writing their personal statement essays as well, I'm always like make sure you relate this back to how you're going to be a better med student because they want to kind of Envision you as a med student while reading this or how this relates you back to being a better physician and the future like especially when I'm editing extracurriculars. I give that advice more than a personal statement. I say and I feel like I just learned something new where it's like you don't have to do that. Actually. They know you're applying to med school because you have some interest in medicine and that should already show in your application in one way or another but I think you really just defined interesting there where you branched out. It seems like in your undergrad career and you had different experiences. Would you say you were very active and that kind of gave you that basically experience box to kind of pull stuff out from for your essays.
Hmm, I guess so, what do you mean by acted like in terms of extracurriculars?
Yes. I'm trying to think like a lot of people including me struggle with thinking of an experience or story to kind of talk about when I'm writing my essays and you said that you made all of your essays very interesting. So for me, I guess I think oh interesting means like you were active and had a lot of great experiences that you could write about and that made you interesting or would you say it was more your writing style?
I actually think, I don't know that I was more active than you know, the average student in undergrad just because everyone is you go do like everyone was doing things like I must have been involved in like what like four or five activities like I think a lot of people are involved in that number of activities, but I do think I would like before writing my essays. I would really just like reflect on what it was that I learned like for any like, you know say like a hospital volunteering type experience. I would really kind of think about like, what were the particular instances that like made me see myself in this field. I like what were the most poignant like part of my experience and like I don't know if that makes any sense that like I do think it gave it a lot of thought just like what exactly from each experience was special to me and also just in general like I don't necessarily think it has to come from like my experience in this club or my experience running this organization. Sometimes it's just like a book that you read or like you're listening to a podcast and you hear something that like it's really like like resonates with you, you know, so I feel like it's also just a matter of like identifying those particular things that really impact you and like I don't, for me I don't think they necessarily always came from the activities I was doing I don't know if that makes any sense. I'm not sure if I'm like conveying the thing right now.
I'm sorry to like draw that question out, but that's I think he provided a lot of great value and answering that question. But in respect for time, I'm going to move on to the next question. So like I said, I've been following your Instagram page for a while and again for those of you who are listening @thisgirlnamedsophiia and I've admired your posts and I was wondering when you have a great sense of style. You mentioned you like doing DIY, thrifting maybe you do thriftlips tpp which is definitely an interest in mind. And I was wondering kind of how you got into the social media space like one what inspired that and then how do you go about scheduling your posts. For those people interested in like kind of how Instagram influences work, do you hire a photographer or do you make sure you post every day? How do you organize that part of your life especially when you’re so busy with school?
Yeah, definitely.
In terms of like a how I got into that space. I think I mean I was seeing other like instagrammers and vloggers kind of doing that work and I just think like I had always been interested in fashion and I never considered it a real career path. Like my parents are you know, South Asian immigrants like when I was young and I was interested in fashion. They were like that's like not a real job and I don't blame them because you know at that time before this like social media explosion I don't think there was a lot of transparency on like how to get into this, you know fashion space and like what type of job opportunities there were, you know, like I was interested in fashion and like this vague sense, but if you ask 10 year old Sophia like oh like what are the different job opportunities in you know fashion, like I wouldn't be able to tell you like. Oh you can be a buyer. You can be like a writer for these like whatever Publications. You can do yada yada, like I wouldn't have even known what job opportunities existed. So I never considered it a real career path and then around you know, when I was in college, I began seeing people kind of working in this like il, I guess in or adjacent to like this fashion industry and like makeup and beauty industry and I just thought it was really cool. And that was like kind of a path that I had never pursued but like was always interesting to me. So I was just like yeah, I want to do this. I think I can do this too. I see other people doing it. Like why can't I do it and also yeah so is a very just intentional thing for me a lot of people who are in this space when you talk to them, they'll say like, oh it just happened like I was posting and I was gaining a lot of followers. Like that's not how this works. If you're going to take a photo of your outfit every day--Yeah, like if you're gonna take a photo of your out Fit and post it every day. That is intentional. Right you're making a decision and that is what I did. Like I wanted to enter this space. And so I did and I do work with the photographer. So I shoot like once every couple weeks. I shoot for like an hour. And in that hour I'm able to get like six outfits Trot until like I'm very I think just like intentional about it. My photographer is wonderful. His handle is @wildnyc for anyone listening. In the New York area he brings like this tent and I just like this pop up tent and I just like change my clothes in there between outfits. It's so efficient. And so yeah, I just like knock out all of my outfits and I work with Brands a lot nowadays. And so, you know when you're working with the brand you have to provide like a professional photo like the content just has to be professional because they're paying you and so like I you know, There's no option like you definitely have to work with the photographer, but I try to like block it so I'm not going out and shooting multiple times a week or anything. Like I just you know, the less frequently I can shoot the better and in terms of scheduling I do use an app called Preview. And so you can just play around with like the photos and like what kind you want to arrange them and stuff, but the only thing I really have to schedule around is like if I tell a brand okay, I'm going to post your photo by this date. Other than that I post like whatever I want and like whatever I'm really feeling is the caption. Obviously, we just went through an election. So I was posting my captions were like kind of focused on that is like a major thing was happening.
But yeah, that's what's great about it. So you are able to kind of combine your love for fashion, but also make it relevant to what you're doing every day and what you believe in so you did a great job like combining your passion project of fashion industry and clothes and sharing that with The world collaborating with different brands and sharing that but also the other side of it where you have you have your opinions you want to influence people positively to like make our world better. So that's a great use of Instagram. Thank you. So the next question I would like to ask is I know we talked a little bit about how you are in your research year so this question might not be super relevant to residency. But if you aren't thinking about residency right now, I was kind of wondering what that process looks like so for me, I'm a second-year med student and I don't really know much about applying to residency and I'm kind of learning all of my classmates don't know either. I'm just like okay, you need your step one and two scores and you rec letters but is that it? So what else do you need?
So you pretty much always have to do I think a sub-internship which is like your or other schools call it and acting internship, which is basically, you know, it'll be like a month-long where you kind of have the responsibility. Use of a an intern so like a first-year resident and you're just trying it out you're like trying on that specialty like when it's actually going to be like when you are, you know an intern and so that I think most people do before applying. I have heard of cases where people do it during the process of applying but I feel like you would probably want to get letters of Rec from the you know, the the people you work with during the sub-internship, so I feel it makes more sense to do it before and then you can also do electives which I think most people do those during the process of applying to like at some point during the fourth year. I still have to do like one elective. So I'll do that but that generally is less responsibility than the sub-internship. So I think yeah, it's like your exam scores and then your letters of Rec but I think you know when you're your essays and stuff you kind of have to talk about like why you want to do that specialty. And so I do think the sub-internship also helps with that just because that's the closest experience you're going to get before actually doing the residency, so I think yeah just ironing out like why you want to do that particular field.
Is it normal to apply to a lot of different residency options or is that not normal?
Meaning like applying to like OB guy in and heeds.
Yeah, say something like that.
No, I don't think that's very common at all one. Basically just one then any apply to different that. Yeah. Most people will yes apply just to 1 specialty.
All right, and when do you do? I don't think I've actually ever heard of a sub-internship. So what year is that common in?
For us it would be , Like second half of your third year first half of your fourth year. I think that's probably the most common
I'd like to look more into that to see if even my school offers that and you said it six months long.
No, no one month. Yeah. No. No, I'm sure your school offers that it's like a requirement. It's a requirement to apply to residency. So like a hundred percent your school offers it.
So thank you for sharing that that's something to be helpful for current medstudents.
My last question is what is one piece of advice that changed your life or really affected you in a way positively that you would like to share with everyone today.
Yeah, that's a really good question. I when you sent me this question, I was like God I don't I really don't know because there's not one thing that comes to mind like, you know one particular thing, but I guess like there's a couple things that I I do, you know, sometimes think about like when I'm giving advice to other people. So one of them is just like a lot of times people will say like oh like I'm 28 like by the time I applied a residency or I apply to med school like I'm gonna be like 30 and then I'm going to be 34 when I graduate. I like I'm just going to be so old and like, you know, I once heard something like, you know, you're going to be 30 one day. Anyways, like you might as well just do the thing you want to do, you know, you're going to be 34 one day anyways, you might as well be a doctor at this before like time is not gonna be you know stop so I'm like, we're all getting older.
That's so true. I actually really like that perspective. I have never heard it raised in that way before.
Yeah. Yeah, so I think like that is one thing not that I mean, I didn't take any time off between undergrad and med school. So it's not really something that like has affected me as much because like, and then the other thing that I think I sometimes think about is just my so my dad would always say like make sure your intentions are good. And I don't know like I don't know what it is, but like I think in Islam like there's a lot of emphasis on like what your intentions are in terms of how you are judge ultimately and so he would always say like, you know, if your intentions are good you'll succeed. So like if your goal is just to make money like you might not be that successful, but if you look really want to help people then I think there's this idea that like that will motivate you and whatever anyways, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so I try to like channel that a lot of times like when I'm struggling I'm just like, okay like it's fine. Like I want to help people like hopefully I can achieve that so I don't know that's something that he always says to me so that's like common piece of advice that I like try to live my life by and I feel like sometimes I think about it. I'm like, how can you like make your intentions good like isn't that just like inherently and you know what? I mean? Like, how can you change your intentions?
I think it's so I've been focusing a lot on what my wy and I'm just going to clear up my notifications on my phone so I can show my recent screen saver for those of you who are watching the video, but it says remember why you started and I think like we kind of got lost in our overall goal or were like, oh my gosh when I'm 30 or when I'm 40, this is what I want my life to look like and something I saw in Tik-Tok recently. It was also about remembering your wy. If if you have a good why I'm sure like everyone's intentions are good with what their purpose kind of wants to be. So what she does is she writes out a list 1 through 7. And for a number one she writes like what she wants right and then the next bullet points for number 2 3 4 it's always like okay, but why do I want that and then it could be like, oh I want this so I can take care of my parents and then the next one would be but why do you want to take care of your parents while I want to take care of my parents because I love them and I want to give back to them. Well, like why do you want to give that back to them? So you do that seven time and I think in that you figure out, you know what your intention really is, and it's never going to be a bad intention. But sometimes your overarching like goal can kind of you know You distract you from that. Maybe yeah, I think I read that. I think that makes sense. I mean, I do think a lot of people's intention is just like to make money and like maybe I'm just maybe I'm just like like my I want to make money like I want to live a comfortable life, right but then exercise because I definitely have like better reasons at least for me personally as to like what I want to get there and it kind of comes down to family and that's a good intention like
Why do I want to be at that level when I'm 30 or 40? Oh because I want to have the financial freedom to spend time with my family. Why do I want to spend time with my family? Because I really value like being my partner and being with my kids and the future and making sure they have like a fulfilling life growing up not like that. I'm going to be gone for most of the day and I only get to tuck them in at night. So that kind of breaks it down right for me. And I feel like if people maybe do that exercise it be able to kind of see like what their intention is and really why they want what they want. I think so. Yeah. Thing that makes sense. Yeah, and now that was awesome advice. I'm definitely going to try to incorporate that into like the decisions. I make moving forward to the thanks for sharing that the.
Thank you Sofia so much for joining today's podcast. I really loved talking to you and getting to know you more. Thank you for coming on and for everyone that's listening. If you have enjoyed the podcast make sure you hit subscribe. So you don't miss any episodes released every Monday Wednesday and Friday Also, if you've learned one little thing from the show, I would really appreciate it. If you could leave a rating and review, it means a lot to me and I read them all I'll see you guys in the next one.
Hey, welcome. This is Episode 17 in this episode, I have the pleasure of interviewing Sophia, who is a fourth year medical student at Yale. I have been a long term follower of her Instagram account @thisgirlnamedsohia who puts a lot of great fashion content with empowering captions.
Sophia really uses her platform to spread knowledge and raises her voice against the common injustices of the world. She is also a co-host of a podcast called Red, White and Brown, where they discuss the struggles of being first-generation immigrants from South Asia in the US. I'm so excited to ask her more about her journey, her stats and what applying to residency has been looking like. Hi, Sophia, thank you so much for joining me today. I'm really excited to have you on the episode. How are you?
Good. Thank you so much for having me. Excited to be here.
Of course, I know you're talking a little bit earlier, but I've been following your account for like the past two to three years has been really awesome to kind of see your platform grow and then finally have the opportunity to speak a little bit more.
Well, thank you so much. You’ve definitely been around since the early days then.
I think I joined when maybe your second year at Yale? But has your experience been like you? How have you like the last four years now that you're almost done?
Yeah, it's been really good. So I don't think we discussed this, but I'm in my fourth year. But it's a research year, so I am I still have one more year basically because I'll be applying next cycle, OK. But yeah, the light at the end of the tunnel is, you know, it's there.
So I've been hearing a lot more people say that they're doing a research year. Go ahead and tell us a little bit about yourself, your background and where you're from, what you're doing and how everything's going.
Yeah, definitely. So I am a Pakistani American. I was born and raised in Chicago. I grew up in the city. So like in the city of Chicago, not like a nearby suburb. The way sometimes people sometimes people from like Skokie or like Naperville will say they're from Chicago. But I am truly from Chicago. F
I’m from Boston. But I'm from a suburb.
Yeah. So you know what I mean. Yeah, I'm from the city. I attended public school my entire life and I graduated high school in 2013 and then went off to Princeton for college where I majored in public policy. But obviously I was also premed and then I graduated in twenty seventeen and I started med school here at Yale. So I didn't take any time off between undergrad and med school. And I'm currently as I mentioned in it's my fourth consecutive year, but it's a third year. So I'm not actually applying to residency yet. But so it's basically going to be a five year program for me. I'm in year four of five, but yeah. And then outside of school, I enjoy reading, listening to podcasts, working on the podcast that my classmate and I started and obviously also enjoy fashion. I love like DIY and surfing and all of that. And then I also enjoy cooking.
That's awesome. We have a lot of similar interests then. I don't have this as a written question, but I kind of want to delve into a little bit more about why you decided to do research year, how you kind of made that decision for yourself?
Yeah, definitely. So one thing I will say is I know every school kind of approaches it differently and it's much more common at some schools than other schools. So at Yale, it is actually very common to do a research year. I think probably 80 percent of my class is doing it. At the time of interviewing, that was actually something that they emphasized very heavily, that we encourage research, we're really into scholarship. And you're going to have the opportunity to do a research year here if you want to, like everyone has the opportunity. So that was like a big part of, I think, Yale and their system and they really encourage it. So given that that was like sort of the baseline and like so many people were doing it, I think it makes it easier to pursue that path because I think at a lot of other places, it's if you're doing a research year, you're probably in the minority. And any time you're doing something different, that makes it a little bit tougher, right? Yeah. So I think that's one thing. I'll say the other. Just with COVID this year, obviously has thrown things off for everyone, and so I was originally actually not planning to do a research year. I was just going to go straight through. I had done my sub internships, got my letters of recommendation. A lot of stuff was actually in place, like a lot of that legwork to apply as I've already done it. But I hadn't taken a step two. And part of that is because Yale does things differently where we do our clinical year and then you take step one and step two back to back. So, yeah, yeah, it's different.
It's definitely different. And so, yeah, I was I took step one earlier this year as a fourth-year medical student. I did step one and then just yeah. Step two is still on the agenda. But I think things were feeling a little bit rushed just because I would have to basically be applying to residency and taking step two at the same time and also working on my thesis. And I'm going to be totally honest with I was feeling like, yeah, things were just rushed and I didn't think I would have enough time to devote to my thesis and do like a really stellar job. And so I was just like, you know what? It is so common to take this extra year that I should just do it when I was an undergrad. We also everyone at Princeton is required to do a thesis. And so I was like interviewing for med school while also taking classes and doing my thesis at the same time. And at the end of it, my thesis wasn't something I was super proud of just because that was kind of the last priority. Right. Priority number one is like getting into med school at that time. So I didn't want the same thing to happen again this time where I could kind of tell it was going in that direction. And so I was my ultimate decision was just like, you know what, let me take the year, do a good job on this thesis, maybe try to get like a couple of publications this year, and then I'll just strengthen my residency application altogether. And hopefully maybe the situation around covid will be a little bit more subtle next year. And like the process of applying to like it might, there might just be more clarity around it.
There was a lot of important stuff you said in there. So you realized you kind of rush things coming out of undergrad to just get into medical school and you rushed your thesis. Is your thesis required, by the way, for Yale too?
Yes. So it's just nice that you took a step back and you were like, it's OK if I take an extra year, I'm not going to rush into things again and I'm going to just perform quality work rather than just kind of go, go, go. I'm sure you're appreciating the subtle break that's kind of been as well.
Definitely.
I can’t imagine taking step one and two back to back either. That's just a lot of again. Go, go, go. Like no breaks.
Yeah.
So that's awesome. I want to talk about step back and talk about your premed days really quick with my next question. But coming out of Princeton must have taken your mcat probably around your junior year. It was probably set in stone around junior year to to apply and not take that gap year after college. If you don't mind sharing. What did your stats look like for applying?
Yeah, so I actually publicly never shared my stats. So and the reason the reason is because I feel like it's not like a helpful motivational story, like I don't have stats that are like super low that I can say like, oh, look, like you can get into med school with like lower stats like my stats were good. And also and also just because I think the schools they publish what their averages are. Right. So Yale's average and I think is a 520, and I had a 520 so that's it's just nothing like out of the ordinary.
And so I just don't feel like it's helpful or motivational. That's why I've never shared that my GPA at the time of applying, I genuinely I don't even remember I was somewhere between a three point seven and the 3.9, but what I will say is that I remember at the time when I was applying thinking that my GPA was on like kind of a lower end because again these schools publish their averages and right so to Yale’s averages of like 3.85 anything and so my GPA must have been below that and I just the reason I don't share like what it was is because I think it's misleading also so Princeton at the time was known for also having great deflation like along with our transcripts they would send a note saying that like only 30% of students are Allowed to receive an a grade like, you know what I mean? Like there was this policy of just like limiting the number of As and just you know, it was a well-known fact that like we had this great deflation policy that has since changed. I think the culture is still kind of the same where professors are not just like handing out A's but at the end yeah. Yeah. I know it's crazy and it makes it very difficult because likeIf I was surrounded by brilliant people and if only 30% can get an A like 70% the other 70% are still doing very well, you know, so it makes it challenging but our like health professionals advising office they had definitely warned us that like, you know, don't worry about like he's average GPA is like even if you have a little bit lower like schools will still take you because they know we have this policy. And so yeah, so my GPA is probably on the lower end of like what my my meds school class like gpas are and so yeah, that's part of the reason I don't share it is because like if I think if I was coming from another institution and I had the GPA I had I don't know if I would have gotten it like I think it's only okay because of where I was coming from and I'm not saying that's a good thing. I'm not saying that's a bad thing other schools also have this sort of policy. I know U Chicago has this policy or a similar like they're known for also having great deflation and You know, it's it is what it is. But I just yeah, that's kind of the reason I've been so reluctant, but it it was probably like I don't know like a 3.75 o or something like around there.
But no, you know what? I think I feel special that you were, you know comfortable enough sharing those numbers on the podcast today, but I think that's why I also ask that follow-up question as to like, what do you think really stood out in your application overall when you were applying to these schools because I know that there are people 'well that definitely their stats help them get in and those people that don't have those stats have something maybe really awesome on their application like extracurriculars or something about the hobbies that they do that helped them get in but I definitely think there were a lot of people I'm sure applying to Ivy medical schools with really high stats, right but not all of them got into Yale. So there still was something about your application. There's only I'm sure your class is relatively small maybe like 80 people.
Around there. Yeah, I think so thousands of applications coming in. So there's still something that you know makes you stand out that's different. So even if your stats are high and you don't have a special story like you think you don't have a special story, but there's still something there. That's gonna help people listening you like. Oh, like that's kind of like what she was doing on the side as well for her extracurriculars. Like this is her background, you know, you want sentences great school. It's a great thing when you're saying that probably helped you stand out with like the 3:7 GPA which is On the lower end of their average, but I would love to hear kind of more about what your extracurriculars look like or what do you think really stood out like what something that they talk to you a lot about maybe during your interview that you think helped you send out to.
I guess I do think that my application was probably like quote-onquote interesting because I did have a you know, a lot of them sort of basic like Hospital volunteering like research experience all of those things but then I mean I also wrote about like my interest in fashion and like just like fashion design and like I am really interested even just like designing and sewing my own clothes and you know, that's something I like. I think that was probably different. I do remember getting.
Yeah, like that's exactly those looking for because a lot of people aren't sure if they can share that kind of stuff on it. Med school application like like that's the one thing that's going to make you stand out so you should share with them.
Yeah, I totally agree. And I I mean even like for applying to undergrad I feel like my application was interesting. Like I really think like for anything I've gotten accepted to whether it's a school or like an internship or whatever else. I do think I've always liked that interesting candidate. I also definitely put a lot of work into like the essays on stuff and so my like the writing that I submitted was very good. Like I think it was probably above, you know, the sort of average essay that was that they were reading and I again when I say that I mean like it was just interesting right? Like I do think I was able to capture the reader's attention like even now when I go back and look at some of my essays but I'm like, yeah like this good like I I put a lot of work into this. And just revising drafts like 10-12 times just to really make sure that the writing was, you know, just captured exactly what I wanted to say. And I I also talked a lot about even I don't know just like cultural things. Like I wasn't shy to talk about like my background and my culture and like religion and like I don't know just like religious like philosophies. Things that have influenced me and I know sometimes people are reluctant to share especially like as a Muslim like a lot of people are like, oh, I don't really want to share that.
Yeah, I was like I had a good experience when you're an MSA with a speaker that we invited and I really struggled with like should I make this I wanted to make it my meaningful experience and I did end up doing that because it you know helped me grow a lot in certain ways, but I was definitely reluctant. I was not sure if I could do that.
Yeah. Yeah, I think a lot of people feel that way and like I think if you can talk about like your culture or religion or whatever. In an interesting way, I think definitely do it, you know it's and it's also not just like one person reading. You know what I mean? It's not just going to be one person who looks at your application and makes the decision. It's multiple people. So like the odds that you're gonna like offend someone there. I think they're pretty low, especially the schools to do value diversity. So yeah, I think just like my writing was good. I kind of included like these interesting tidbits here and there. The other thing I will say is I study public policy, which I think is not super uncommon because a lot of people focus on like Global health and like public health policy and stuff in undergrad and they talk about that when applying but my focus was not really on Healthcare was more sort of like I had a couple of experiences that were more like the counterterrorism like arena so it was just very different to anything or anyone writing about that. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So I think a lot of times people feel like they need to relate all of their activities back to medicine and and in some ways I think that's good. Like it's important to be able to draw parallels between like, you know, your extracurriculars and medicine but sometimes I also think it's okay to study something like totally separate. Because you're still gonna have your pre-med classes, right? So yeah, I think the more if you can Branch out and like study something else that's interesting and still do well and you know, the core pre-med classes then I think that's I think that's great like that. That is what makes candidates interesting think.
Yeah. No, that's great advice because I think I just learned something new to I've come to kind of been giving the advice that when people are writing their personal statement essays as well, I'm always like make sure you relate this back to how you're going to be a better med student because they want to kind of Envision you as a med student while reading this or how this relates you back to being a better physician and the future like especially when I'm editing extracurriculars. I give that advice more than a personal statement. I say and I feel like I just learned something new where it's like you don't have to do that. Actually. They know you're applying to med school because you have some interest in medicine and that should already show in your application in one way or another but I think you really just defined interesting there where you branched out. It seems like in your undergrad career and you had different experiences. Would you say you were very active and that kind of gave you that basically experience box to kind of pull stuff out from for your essays.
Hmm, I guess so, what do you mean by acted like in terms of extracurriculars?
Yes. I'm trying to think like a lot of people including me struggle with thinking of an experience or story to kind of talk about when I'm writing my essays and you said that you made all of your essays very interesting. So for me, I guess I think oh interesting means like you were active and had a lot of great experiences that you could write about and that made you interesting or would you say it was more your writing style?
I actually think, I don't know that I was more active than you know, the average student in undergrad just because everyone is you go do like everyone was doing things like I must have been involved in like what like four or five activities like I think a lot of people are involved in that number of activities, but I do think I would like before writing my essays. I would really just like reflect on what it was that I learned like for any like, you know say like a hospital volunteering type experience. I would really kind of think about like, what were the particular instances that like made me see myself in this field. I like what were the most poignant like part of my experience and like I don't know if that makes any sense that like I do think it gave it a lot of thought just like what exactly from each experience was special to me and also just in general like I don't necessarily think it has to come from like my experience in this club or my experience running this organization. Sometimes it's just like a book that you read or like you're listening to a podcast and you hear something that like it's really like like resonates with you, you know, so I feel like it's also just a matter of like identifying those particular things that really impact you and like I don't, for me I don't think they necessarily always came from the activities I was doing I don't know if that makes any sense. I'm not sure if I'm like conveying the thing right now.
I'm sorry to like draw that question out, but that's I think he provided a lot of great value and answering that question. But in respect for time, I'm going to move on to the next question. So like I said, I've been following your Instagram page for a while and again for those of you who are listening @thisgirlnamedsophiia and I've admired your posts and I was wondering when you have a great sense of style. You mentioned you like doing DIY, thrifting maybe you do thriftlips tpp which is definitely an interest in mind. And I was wondering kind of how you got into the social media space like one what inspired that and then how do you go about scheduling your posts. For those people interested in like kind of how Instagram influences work, do you hire a photographer or do you make sure you post every day? How do you organize that part of your life especially when you’re so busy with school?
Yeah, definitely.
In terms of like a how I got into that space. I think I mean I was seeing other like instagrammers and vloggers kind of doing that work and I just think like I had always been interested in fashion and I never considered it a real career path. Like my parents are you know, South Asian immigrants like when I was young and I was interested in fashion. They were like that's like not a real job and I don't blame them because you know at that time before this like social media explosion I don't think there was a lot of transparency on like how to get into this, you know fashion space and like what type of job opportunities there were, you know, like I was interested in fashion and like this vague sense, but if you ask 10 year old Sophia like oh like what are the different job opportunities in you know fashion, like I wouldn't be able to tell you like. Oh you can be a buyer. You can be like a writer for these like whatever Publications. You can do yada yada, like I wouldn't have even known what job opportunities existed. So I never considered it a real career path and then around you know, when I was in college, I began seeing people kind of working in this like il, I guess in or adjacent to like this fashion industry and like makeup and beauty industry and I just thought it was really cool. And that was like kind of a path that I had never pursued but like was always interesting to me. So I was just like yeah, I want to do this. I think I can do this too. I see other people doing it. Like why can't I do it and also yeah so is a very just intentional thing for me a lot of people who are in this space when you talk to them, they'll say like, oh it just happened like I was posting and I was gaining a lot of followers. Like that's not how this works. If you're going to take a photo of your outfit every day--Yeah, like if you're gonna take a photo of your out Fit and post it every day. That is intentional. Right you're making a decision and that is what I did. Like I wanted to enter this space. And so I did and I do work with the photographer. So I shoot like once every couple weeks. I shoot for like an hour. And in that hour I'm able to get like six outfits Trot until like I'm very I think just like intentional about it. My photographer is wonderful. His handle is @wildnyc for anyone listening. In the New York area he brings like this tent and I just like this pop up tent and I just like change my clothes in there between outfits. It's so efficient. And so yeah, I just like knock out all of my outfits and I work with Brands a lot nowadays. And so, you know when you're working with the brand you have to provide like a professional photo like the content just has to be professional because they're paying you and so like I you know, There's no option like you definitely have to work with the photographer, but I try to like block it so I'm not going out and shooting multiple times a week or anything. Like I just you know, the less frequently I can shoot the better and in terms of scheduling I do use an app called Preview. And so you can just play around with like the photos and like what kind you want to arrange them and stuff, but the only thing I really have to schedule around is like if I tell a brand okay, I'm going to post your photo by this date. Other than that I post like whatever I want and like whatever I'm really feeling is the caption. Obviously, we just went through an election. So I was posting my captions were like kind of focused on that is like a major thing was happening.
But yeah, that's what's great about it. So you are able to kind of combine your love for fashion, but also make it relevant to what you're doing every day and what you believe in so you did a great job like combining your passion project of fashion industry and clothes and sharing that with The world collaborating with different brands and sharing that but also the other side of it where you have you have your opinions you want to influence people positively to like make our world better. So that's a great use of Instagram. Thank you. So the next question I would like to ask is I know we talked a little bit about how you are in your research year so this question might not be super relevant to residency. But if you aren't thinking about residency right now, I was kind of wondering what that process looks like so for me, I'm a second-year med student and I don't really know much about applying to residency and I'm kind of learning all of my classmates don't know either. I'm just like okay, you need your step one and two scores and you rec letters but is that it? So what else do you need?
So you pretty much always have to do I think a sub-internship which is like your or other schools call it and acting internship, which is basically, you know, it'll be like a month-long where you kind of have the responsibility. Use of a an intern so like a first-year resident and you're just trying it out you're like trying on that specialty like when it's actually going to be like when you are, you know an intern and so that I think most people do before applying. I have heard of cases where people do it during the process of applying but I feel like you would probably want to get letters of Rec from the you know, the the people you work with during the sub-internship, so I feel it makes more sense to do it before and then you can also do electives which I think most people do those during the process of applying to like at some point during the fourth year. I still have to do like one elective. So I'll do that but that generally is less responsibility than the sub-internship. So I think yeah, it's like your exam scores and then your letters of Rec but I think you know when you're your essays and stuff you kind of have to talk about like why you want to do that specialty. And so I do think the sub-internship also helps with that just because that's the closest experience you're going to get before actually doing the residency, so I think yeah just ironing out like why you want to do that particular field.
Is it normal to apply to a lot of different residency options or is that not normal?
Meaning like applying to like OB guy in and heeds.
Yeah, say something like that.
No, I don't think that's very common at all one. Basically just one then any apply to different that. Yeah. Most people will yes apply just to 1 specialty.
All right, and when do you do? I don't think I've actually ever heard of a sub-internship. So what year is that common in?
For us it would be , Like second half of your third year first half of your fourth year. I think that's probably the most common
I'd like to look more into that to see if even my school offers that and you said it six months long.
No, no one month. Yeah. No. No, I'm sure your school offers that it's like a requirement. It's a requirement to apply to residency. So like a hundred percent your school offers it.
So thank you for sharing that that's something to be helpful for current medstudents.
My last question is what is one piece of advice that changed your life or really affected you in a way positively that you would like to share with everyone today.
Yeah, that's a really good question. I when you sent me this question, I was like God I don't I really don't know because there's not one thing that comes to mind like, you know one particular thing, but I guess like there's a couple things that I I do, you know, sometimes think about like when I'm giving advice to other people. So one of them is just like a lot of times people will say like oh like I'm 28 like by the time I applied a residency or I apply to med school like I'm gonna be like 30 and then I'm going to be 34 when I graduate. I like I'm just going to be so old and like, you know, I once heard something like, you know, you're going to be 30 one day. Anyways, like you might as well just do the thing you want to do, you know, you're going to be 34 one day anyways, you might as well be a doctor at this before like time is not gonna be you know stop so I'm like, we're all getting older.
That's so true. I actually really like that perspective. I have never heard it raised in that way before.
Yeah. Yeah, so I think like that is one thing not that I mean, I didn't take any time off between undergrad and med school. So it's not really something that like has affected me as much because like, and then the other thing that I think I sometimes think about is just my so my dad would always say like make sure your intentions are good. And I don't know like I don't know what it is, but like I think in Islam like there's a lot of emphasis on like what your intentions are in terms of how you are judge ultimately and so he would always say like, you know, if your intentions are good you'll succeed. So like if your goal is just to make money like you might not be that successful, but if you look really want to help people then I think there's this idea that like that will motivate you and whatever anyways, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so I try to like channel that a lot of times like when I'm struggling I'm just like, okay like it's fine. Like I want to help people like hopefully I can achieve that so I don't know that's something that he always says to me so that's like common piece of advice that I like try to live my life by and I feel like sometimes I think about it. I'm like, how can you like make your intentions good like isn't that just like inherently and you know what? I mean? Like, how can you change your intentions?
I think it's so I've been focusing a lot on what my wy and I'm just going to clear up my notifications on my phone so I can show my recent screen saver for those of you who are watching the video, but it says remember why you started and I think like we kind of got lost in our overall goal or were like, oh my gosh when I'm 30 or when I'm 40, this is what I want my life to look like and something I saw in Tik-Tok recently. It was also about remembering your wy. If if you have a good why I'm sure like everyone's intentions are good with what their purpose kind of wants to be. So what she does is she writes out a list 1 through 7. And for a number one she writes like what she wants right and then the next bullet points for number 2 3 4 it's always like okay, but why do I want that and then it could be like, oh I want this so I can take care of my parents and then the next one would be but why do you want to take care of your parents while I want to take care of my parents because I love them and I want to give back to them. Well, like why do you want to give that back to them? So you do that seven time and I think in that you figure out, you know what your intention really is, and it's never going to be a bad intention. But sometimes your overarching like goal can kind of you know You distract you from that. Maybe yeah, I think I read that. I think that makes sense. I mean, I do think a lot of people's intention is just like to make money and like maybe I'm just maybe I'm just like like my I want to make money like I want to live a comfortable life, right but then exercise because I definitely have like better reasons at least for me personally as to like what I want to get there and it kind of comes down to family and that's a good intention like
Why do I want to be at that level when I'm 30 or 40? Oh because I want to have the financial freedom to spend time with my family. Why do I want to spend time with my family? Because I really value like being my partner and being with my kids and the future and making sure they have like a fulfilling life growing up not like that. I'm going to be gone for most of the day and I only get to tuck them in at night. So that kind of breaks it down right for me. And I feel like if people maybe do that exercise it be able to kind of see like what their intention is and really why they want what they want. I think so. Yeah. Thing that makes sense. Yeah, and now that was awesome advice. I'm definitely going to try to incorporate that into like the decisions. I make moving forward to the thanks for sharing that the.
Thank you Sofia so much for joining today's podcast. I really loved talking to you and getting to know you more. Thank you for coming on and for everyone that's listening. If you have enjoyed the podcast make sure you hit subscribe. So you don't miss any episodes released every Monday Wednesday and Friday Also, if you've learned one little thing from the show, I would really appreciate it. If you could leave a rating and review, it means a lot to me and I read them all I'll see you guys in the next one.
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