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WHY do you want to be a DOCTOR? w/ Hailey
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Welcome to MedKinza talks your go-to source for bite-sized content and becoming future doctors. I'm your host Kinza Hussein, and I'm a second year medical student helping students navigate the ins and outs of one of the most competitive careers. I will be sharing the lessons I've learned in inviting guest speakers to provide real quality advice. To help you get into medical school, succeed as a med student and prepare you to become a future doctor, want more free quality advice. Subscribe to my YouTube channel and follow me on Instagram @medkinza, where I post videos and infographics, delivering content to you every week. Now, sit back, relax, and learn something new and don't forget to hit subscribe. So you don't miss any of my latest episodes released every week.
Hey, welcome. This is episode 18. In this episode, I have the pleasure of interviewing Hailey. She is a second year student at an osteopathic medical school. I found her on Instagram, where she posts really great aesthetically pleasing photos and talks about her personal journey towards med school. Hailey has a great post on her Instagram @busyscrubs about her three gap years and all the things she did during that time that helped her grow personally and academically. Today, I'll be asking her a few questions to dive deeper into her application stats and why she wanted to become a doctor. Keep listening if you want some insight from admitted students. Hi Hayley. Thanks so much for joining me today. How are you?
No, I'm good. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah.
What are you up to?
Um, you know, just about to study renal, um, it's snowing outside. My cats are running around and sipping some coffee.
That sounds like it's coming out of a movie that sounds really like cozy.
It's the winter Wonderland over here.
It snowed once up where I am. Um, but it was light. It was just a couple of inches and it melted right after. So we're waiting for that next snow storm, I guess.
Yeah, it's definitely, I definitely am not going to be leaving my house, which is not a change. You know, I don't really leave my house much either.
I like try to go to the gym. I feel like that's the only thing that gets me out of the house when I do go. But yeah. Other than that, I don't really go out grocery shopping maybe.
Yeah, that is my big outing. I have my spin bikes. I'll find that I'll do anything. Grocery food. Food is the main motivator. But tell us a little bit about yourself. Where are you from? Who are you? Okay. Um, fun questions is always the question that I just read that during the medical school interview, who am I? I don't know. I don't know who I am. Um, so I'm Hailey. Um, I am originally from California, Los Angeles. Um, I went to an all-girls Catholic high school. I'm not Catholic, but I think it's a fun fact about me. Loved it. How'd you survive? I'm like it was, I thrived, it was great. Went there from seventh to 12th grade, very sheltered, but yeah. And then,um, I traveled to Northern California for college. I went to UC Davis, go ads. And, um, I majored in, I did a double major actually in English and genetics and genomics. And then, um, now I'm in medical school. Um, so that's a little bit about me. Um, I'm not going to reveal exactly where I go to medical school because my mom has made me somewhat paranoid of strangers on the internet. So I'm just going to,
Yeah, I'm always paranoid.
No, like I'm sure people can find out with some slew thing, but you know, whatever.
I'm so crazy about it because I listened to murder podcasts and that's probably why it's like always on my mind.
I'm like, it's like, what if weird sounds? Or like when I'm around my car, making sure the doors are locked, closing the blinds. It occupies my mind. So I totally get that. But, um, thanks so much for sharing some background. It's so cool that you're from LA. How did you like that growing up?
Um, I, I mean, I love California. It's crazy expensive. I actually, you know, don't hesitate to saying this, but I actually like Northern California more. Um, yeah. So, uh, after I graduated from UC Davis, I actually moved to San Francisco for a little bit and just, I love San Francisco, but LA it's hard because everything's really spread out. Um, I feel like versus San Francisco, the city everything's so central, it's, you know, it's kind of like a small, small town feel in a big city. Um, or I don't know if it's a big city, but I've never been to New York, so I know, but, um, yeah, LA is, it's very spread out. I love the beaches. I mean, you can't beat that. They're so beautiful, warm, and you can actually go in them. But, um, yeah, I just, I like the there's way more greenery in Northern California. Everyone was just really nice LA you kind of get the little bit of like the pretentious side aspects, but, um, it's home. So, you know,
I can’t wait to get out there one day. So, no, I can't wait to go, but I want to dive a little bit deeper into like your application, right. So I was very interested, um, in that post about, you know, your three gap years that you took. And a lot of people reach out to me asking about gap years and it seems like people are just now starting to kind of get used to that concept. And it's very normal to take time off, but I think it's scary for people cause you know, we're not used to it. We go to school like back to back our whole lives and then we get out of college and we're like, how are we supposed to take a gap year? Now we're just going to just go straight into med school. But it's not very common anymore to do that. So if you don't mind talking a little bit about how, like what motivated you to take those gap years, what mindset you had to even do that and like just some of your stats while applying, that would be great.
Yeah, of course. You know, I actually get that a lot too. Uh, I've gotten a lot of questions on Instagram. Direct message of like is like is 25 too old, you know? And I'm like, why, why is this a thing? You know, I think it's so American too, you know, in the US we always are just go, go, go, never take a break. And for me, I knew going into undergrad that I wanted to take gap years because your girl's going to be burned out. You know, I was, I was very go, go, go. in college. I had, I was working a ton of jobs and just constantly busy. So for me, I really, really wanted to take time off after, cause I knew that one starting medical school, I would just be, I would just be burnt out. So I wanted to in the time off make money, um, because it's expensive, uh, have opportunities that you probably won't get to have once you enter medical school, you know, because, um, you know, taking time to travel, things like that, once you're in medical school, it is very go, go go also. I mean, you go from medical school to your residency to actually, you know, your career. So for me, I wanted to take time to travel. I wanted to spend a lot of time with family. Um, and it just made the most sense to me. I wasn't really thinking about, Oh man, I'm going to be 30 something by the time I'm actually practicing. Um, that wasn't really an issue for me. I think, you know, you're going to be 30 anyway. What's, what's the difference. I think it's people always have their timeline, you know, well, I want to be doing this by the time I'm this age. And I just, I think do don't do what society expects of you. You know, if you think that you need to have your career done by the time you're 30 and or 25, um, who cares do what you want to do, if you think that you're going to be the most successful by taking time off and like getting to really experience life I say, go for it. I think the fact that I took time off has made me eventually I think will make me a better physician because I actually had some real-world experiences. I also think for people who, who, um, you know, don't get the opportunity to work much in college. I think it's an important thing that you do before you enter medical school. I think in medical school, it's very apparent that people who come straight from medical school and I'm not saying that's a bad thing at all, but I just think that you're, you know, you're a little more sheltered and you haven't seen for me, I know a lot about insurance. You know, I know a lot about, um, benefits, excuse me, and things like that. And I wouldn't have learned at all about that if it weren't for having worked after, after medical school and like being in the workforce. Um, and I don't know if that answers the question much, but I just, I don't think you need to concern yourself with a timeline. I don't understand what the stigma is. And I guess for me, when I'm ever questioning something, I'll do worst case scenario, you know? Okay. Worst case scenario. I take gap years. What's the pros of that. Oh, I get to breathe and relax for a second
Funny. Um, I really like that perspective and I think it's cool that you said exactly what, um, I interviewed someone named Sophia in episode 17 and she exactly the same thing. She was like, you're going to be 30 anyways. You're going to be 40 anyways. So might as well like be doing the thing you want to do at that age, no matter what stage you're in. And I love that advice. And I love that. You said you saw a lot of things while working, like you learned about insurance, you learned about what it's actually like to work in the space. Like I've done some volunteering. Yes. I've done some shadowing, but I even, I really don't know what it's going to be like day in to day out. I don't know what the pros are or the cons really are. I don't know the ins and outs at all. So I, I liked that. You said that and I wanted to ask you kind of piggy backing off of that. Do you feel like you said that people who kind of come straight out of college are a little bit more sheltered and there's nothing wrong with that, but it shows, so what's like one thing that you feel like people miss out on when they don't take some gap years before med school, other than just like some world experience?
What’s omething that you're not sheltered about anymore. Kind of.
Okay. Well, here's a big one. I think knowing that people have their own styles for doing things, and one thing is not necessarily better than the other. I think when you come from college or, you know, all you have experienced as college, um, you start to have stereotypes of like, Oh, people who don't go to class are, are slackers. You know? So in medical school, sometimes I had some people say, you know, Oh, so-and-so, doesn't go to class. Even though it's not mandatory, they're probably not doing well. And it's like, no, that's a very sheltered way of thinking. I mean, for some people studying at home is actually way more efficient use of their time. So that's just one little example, you know what I mean? It's like, yeah, you, people do things in their own way. And I don't know if that's necessarily a by-product of, of coming straight from college, but I have heard that multiple times from people who, who are younger and they just, you know, maybe have a specific worldview that hasn't been brought in by, by more, um, experiences.
But yeah, I think, and back to the age thing, I also think, I don't know. I think it's a veryUS thing to, to view it that way. I mean, 30 is not old. 25 is not old. Age is a mindset. You know, I don't know if I have a unique, a unique perspective in that because my parents happened to be older. I mean, my dad is 76 and he is spry. The man is spry. You know, like, I don't think age, age is just a number, you know, I think do whatever you want to do. And don't let that inhibit you. Especially when we have such long life expectancies in US. I don't think that 25 is old. So I think that that's something that you can also broaden a perspective on. There's nothing wrong with, with starting your career at 30.
No, you're right. And even, I, you know, I can take this advice and kind of internalize it. I feel like growing up, I definitely thought 25 was old. Like I'm just going to get, I know I was that person, like, I feel like my parents were always, so scared of getting older and older and they're young. Like they're only in their forties right now. I think, um, I think my dad actually, maybe they hit their fifties now, but, um, they they're, they're always like, Oh, we're getting old, we're getting old. So I always thought saw that as a bad thing. And I'm just going to be old. I want to just like be making like my living my life and have everything together by 30 at least. Cause that's old and then you're gonna have kids and then you're going to get, even if it's still lingering, I'm still trying to get over it. And like, not in like see past it, but I definitely still think about it. So I need to like, maybe-
I'm right there with you. It's hard to challenge. I mean, my sister's turning or my sister just turned 28 and it was like a weird thing for me. I was like, Whoa, you're 28. But it's like, what? You know, it's just ingrained in us in society too, to view it that way. And I don't think that, I think that's something that should be challenged, you know?
It definitely shouldn't be. Thanks for speaking to that. So what were your stats going into school? I know my listeners love to hear the stats.
Well, first of all, I'm going to say comparison is the thief of joy. Don't compare yourself. Everyone has their own different things that they bring to the table. Um,
I ask this question too, that I do want to preface that is because everyone has such different stats. And I think that helps people. And I wish, I wish I heard these stats like earlier in my application cycle. I wish I heard real stories of people who got in rather than just looking on MSAR and seeing five twenties. And I know, and I was just like, Oh my gosh, like, who am I to even like I apply to this school. I was like, they're going to just put my application in the trash. So it really stifled my confidence. And a lot of it was self like negative talk. Totally. But, um, that's why I asked because I've heard so many amazing stories. So far people like getting into med school, like putting everything they're all into these applications, whether they have really good GPA's or lower GPA's. So that's why that's some context as to why I asked for stuff.
No, that's a good point. And I had definitely been nervous too when I applied because I was basing it off of MSAR and all those things. And I even contemplating contemplated doing a postbac after afterwards, but I was like, Oh man, they're so expensive. So I kind of just, you know, shoot my shot. I think you should, if you have the means to, um, you know, maybe just apply to a couple of schools and see, um, if they're in your reach and just try before you pursue a post-bacc cause it is man, it is expensive.
Already like paying for college and take your med school, like this whole post-bac thing. Like I get why some people just have to do it to get their GPA's, but I'm just so against the price that comes with the schooling.
Yeah. And that's another thing that's made me disillusioned to the field is definitely how much of a business it has. Um, but anyway, y'all answered stops avoiding this button. Um, so
If you want to share that's totally up to you.
It's fine.
I don't mind. Um, my GPA after graduating, um, was a 3.5 and my cat was a 510. Um, and my GPA I think was what hindered me more. So I did a double major and um, so English and genetics. And so my English GPA was a 4.0, so I had a little, if you do the math, like I had a little bit of a lower end science GPA. So I think that that was, that was my hindrance a little bit more so, but I was able to make it up a bit with the MCAT.
I'm totally at your, no, honestly your stats are good. I, I, I would say that you're like five, like it's that cutoff Mark. We all talk about in terms of GPA, like where you want it to be. So those are good stats. So how, how many schools did you apply to?
Um, so I knew I wanted to do DO. Um, so I pretty much applied to all the DO schools cause it was the same app and it was really easy to just check off the check off the boxes. Yeah. Yeah. So I definitely love the, um, osteopathic principles. I really wanted to have that extra tool tool set and my toolbox. Um, I really wanted to stray away from the opioid epidemic and have, um, you know, a different way to manage pain. So I really, really liked DO and I was sold on it when I heard about it and especially wanting to potentially do women's health is something that's very applicable. I think if you, you know, maybe you want to do anesthesiology or something, radiology that it's more difficult to incorporate. I think I understand why someone would be swayed towards MD, but for me, I knew that I was going to want to use that in my practice. So I exclusively applied to DO schools. Um, well actually, no, that's not true. So I did apply to two MDs in California just because the location. And I was like, Oh, if I, so I went to like UCLA and UCS. So it was like
Are thereDO sells in California yet. Are there?
Here's two, but I didn't like the location. So there's Western in Southern California and then there's, uh, Toro and uh, in Vallejo, which is kind of close to where I was actually. But, um, yeah, and then I actually randomly fun fact applied to some schools in Australia. Um, yeah, so I love Australia and my boyfriend's actually from there. So we were, but then it was, it was kind of more like a, okay, this is worst case I'll, I'll go to university of Sydney or something, which is an amazing school, but also very far from family. But, uh, I would also have to marry my boyfriend. So that was kind of like an alert. They got it up. I was ready for that yet. So that was, uh, and it was also the whole application was free, which was awesome. Yeah. And they really didn't require much. I mean, it was, it was mostly stats. So it was like, what's your GPA? What was your, they wanted my high school transcript. They wanted my college transcript and they wanted my MCAT, but I didn't really need letters of rec. I didn't really need to put any essays and it was really easy. So I was like, yeah, why not? Let's do it. Like it's free.
So what made you choose, um, uh, sorry, actually, we're not going to talk about your location. I just realized that. So for that question, but, um, that's really, really great to hear. I'm so glad that everything worked out and, you know, you were laser focused on something and that helped too, which was osteopathic medical schools and the OMM. So how have you liked your own mem experience? You are a second year, so you've definitely got some good exposure. I'm sure.
Yeah. So, you know my school's very intense with, with OMT. Uh, we, we take it very seriously and I'm, I really, really like it. I think it's awesome. When, what you do, you can actually see what you're doing. I think first year it's a little bit harder because you're still kind of figuring out what it even means to palpate someone. Um, but I love it. I think, you know, there's definitely some days where I'm like, Oh, I just really want to study for my block course. I don't really want to study OMT right now. I would rather focus my time on studying for the boards or whatnot. But, um, overall I'm really glad for, for how intense my school has made it, especially during quarantine because a lot of schools kind of had to, you know, cancel a lot of their lab work and stuff like that, but still made it somewhat feasible. We had to just record ourselves doing techniques and you know, still stay on top of it. So I really enjoyed it so far. So I'm glad I'm happy with my decision.
That's awesome. My favorite, um, technique and OMM is HBLA, but it doesn't go away. Um, well the back one is cool for the back and that was the first one we learned. And that was the first time I was like super into OMM was like, this is cool because I'm not paying just from bad posture while. Yeah. And I was just like, Oh yeah, it's been hurting like here for like a couple of weeks now. And I'm just like waiting for it to go away. But my professor was like, all right. Yeah. Like, you know, I'll just do the HBLA on you for those of you guys who are listening, HBLA stands for high velocity, low amplitude. And it's basically the cracking method to like crack out the pain. So he did that on me and my pain went away and I was like, this is the coolest thing ever, but think I'm not good at it. I probably just more practice. I really tried. Um, but I'm not good at it. So how, how would you say like on a scale from one to 10, how good at it are you and how much practice do you put into it?
Oh, bad. Okay. Well, I practiced HBLA a lot actually, uh, with my best friend in med school, but, um, just because we were so bad at it, we were like, we need to practice. This is hard as intense anymore. Like cracking someone's back. So I don't want to be bad at it. So I'd say, okay, cervical HBLA no, I'm not good at that. And I'm also insanely terrified to crack someone's neck. Um, so got to practice that one more, but I love rib HBLA. Um, I think that it's a really easy one to do. It is hard because I'm tall. So they always pair me with like big men. So, you know, it's harder when you have like a big guy, you don't know how much exact force you're still trying to put, put on it. So, you know, there's definitely some, um, touch and go stuff. But when it comes to like working on like a small woman, it's easy. Um, but yeah, if I were to practice on some of my guy friends, it's, it's definitely can be a little discouraging, but I think my favorite methods are, uh, first of all, suboccipital release. That's like all the neck work.
I love it. It really works well.
That's amazing. I taught my boyfriend so he could do it on me.
Yeah, I love watching the video version. Hold on, let me move my chair. But I have basically that headboard my bathroom and I put my neck back on it to do my own suboccipital release. And there you go.
That's innovative. I like it. I know sometimes I'll like go through and diagnose myself, but I love sacrum and pelvis. I think that those are awesome. And I think that they're really, I mean, I have very, very tight hamstrings, so I, I sometimes like will sit there and diagnose myself in the seated position, a Cedar flection test. Yeah. And I'm like, you know, I, yeah. I could use some OMT right now. I think that would help fix all my problems.
Yeah. It's a really good tool to have in your job. I agree with that. Um, so another question I have for you is kind of diving more into, like, why did you want to become a doctor? I feel like that's a hard question for a lot of us to answer sometimes when we have to write essays. And although we kind of like, we kind of know why, but like, we don't really know how to talk about it. It's just such a hard question. So I was wondering if you would want to speak a little bit to like what you talked about, like what, what did you say for those essays? Why, why do you want to be a doctor?
Sure. Okay. Loaded question. Um, yeah, no, I think it is really hard to write about because for a lot of people, I mean, it's not just one answer, you know? Um, I have so many reasons why I chose this field, but I'm, I'm one of those weird people who said I wanted to be a doctor since I was like four years old. Um, I don't know what it was. So I think,
Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt, but I'm saying, I don't think that's weird. There's a lot of people that like have that story.
Yeah. I think for some people it really is a calling, you know, and you just, it's something that I always had in the back of my mind. You know, when, when teachers would ask, what do you want to be when you're older, I'd always be doctor. Um, but you know, throughout my life, I actively wanted to test that because it is a very vigorous path. So if there was something that would make me more happy, I was very, very willing to take it. So yeah. You know, throughout high school and college, I would do volunteering and did a ton of extracurriculars just to make sure that that was something that I was really sure about. Um, in high school I worked in a hospital, I actually hated it. I did not like working in a hospital. I thought it was like just very sterile. Uh, so that kind of made me nervous and then when I went into college, um, I did a lot of, a lot of different experiences. So I was a doula. Um, and I worked, I doula is someone who helps assist with, uh, women who are birthing. And, um, I also worked in 18 clinics, so it was kind of like the equivalent of planned Parenthood. Um, so I would dispense and pretty much see the patient throughout the entire visit. It was very hands-on. Um, I was basically like an MA and could dispense birth control and do counseling for, for things like that. Um, and I also worked in, uh, research to kind of question, cause I think epidemiology is really interesting. I love public health. Um, and did some, some lab, uh, some bench work to, to see if I liked that. I did not like that.
Um, and then I, uh, I didn't like bench lab work.
Yeah. Yeah. And then I, my first real taste of clinical work was when I went abroad and that was pretty much what solidified, okay. Yes. I love this. I love clinical work. I think that, that is definitely what really reassured me that I was on the right path. Um, but yeah, you know, I think I have a lot of different reasons why I decided to pursue doctor, because I mean, if you love clinical work, you could do a lot of other things. You could be a nurse could be a PA, you could do PT, you know, there's like a lot of stuff that you can do. Um, but so at the end of the day, you know, I have some very practical reasons and some more emotional reasons of why I chose it. But I think there this degree, mostly the most practical reason is this degree just incorporates all the things that I love. So I thought it would open the most doors for, for everything. So, you know, you have teaching, you can do research, you have leadership, um, branches into advocacy and policy, um, you know, helping people, obviously there's that satisfaction of actually seeing the change that you're making. And I think that that's a, that's a big thing, cause there's plenty of professionals who help people too. But for me, I wanted to actually see that what I was doing was, was helping someone in front of me, um, which is harder to say for some other professions. Um, there's the lifelong learning. Um, yeah, I think, I think I would have been happy at the end of the day with the different, you know, with maybe a PA or NP, but I definitely have the personality type of, I want to be the one who understands why we're doing what we're doing and understands the pathology and kind of like the, what, obviously I love like the teamwork that is in hospitals and not to say that NPs and PAs don't know that, but I just want it to have that extra training. Um, and I knew at the end of the day, I would have, if I had gone PA or NP would have eventually led me to, to get a medical degree. So I just thought, you know, just, let's just cut straight to it. It's just got that degree. Um, and then, you know, another, another reason that was practical, I wanted to be self-sufficient, you know, I think as a woman, I didn't want to be reliant on anyone else. Um, you know, a man or a husband in my life to be the one who supports me. I like that I'd be my own boss and I can, you know, be a part of that change for this field was very male dominated and it's nice too, to be a woman in that field, you know, and it's nice to be able to be self-sufficient. Um, and that's a whole nother topic. I know that it's definitely still a hurdle being a woman in this field, but, um, it does give me satisfaction, you know? Um, and yeah, I don't know. There's just so many reasons I, I liked that were needed. Our profession's always going to be something that is beneficial, especially now in COVID. We can definitely see that our jobs are very essential. Um, I think one of the most important things that this is a very long-winded answer, so yeah.
Got it. No, this is what I need. This is what everyone needs to hear.
So yeah, I, I, for me, I really, really wanted the challenge. I love that, um, obviously medical schools are very challenging. Um, but you know, I've, I've definitely always had an inclination for English, um, humanities. My whole family does no one in my family has science background. No one likes, no ones knows how to do math. No, I'm just kidding. No, we're all, it's like a very Favorite topic of my family, but, uh, we are very liberal arts spirit and my high school you've been, was very, very English dominated. We had Renaissance festivals every year. We were English nerds. Um, yeah, I mean, I had a 4.0 in English in college, so my English degree, I was in the English honors program. So obviously my natural inclination is more humanities related. Um, and you know, I did consider a career in law and a career as an English professor, but, um, I don't know. I thought that if I made something that was my passion into a career, I wouldn't like it as much. So I hopefully I'll still, you know, write a book or something someday, but I really liked that sciences were challenged for me and I wanted to prove to myself that I could do it. Um, so to anyone out there who is, you know, the sole person in their family pursuing this career, you can do it. I think it's, you know, it's definitely challenging. You don't have like, you know, maybe the same resources as other people, but I don't know. I think if you can challenge yourself and, um, you'll probably surprise yourself, but anyway, those are some of my reasons. Um, I actually didn't talk about any of them in my essay though.
How did you like, wait, what did you talk about?
This is why it's awkward. It's because everyone thinks like, I there's so many reasons why I need to be a doctor. How do I make that concise and fit it into an essay? But I think I had my English brain on when I was doing it. Um, and you know, at the end of the day, it is an essay, it's an argumentative essay. So for me, I thought, which of these, like, which obviously it's still very applicable and true to my story, but how am I going to talk about me being, you know, the, I don't know, I guess I could have related to me being the only person, I just didn't think it was going to make for a great essay. So I picked a topic that was a very clear theme for me throughout my education and, uh, throughout all my work that I did. And, um, I wrote about that because I thought that it would be the most unique, um, cause I think a lot of people write their essay and they're saying, you know, I want to help, I want to do this. I want to do that. And it's, it's very generic. So I picked something that I knew was true to me. Um, so yeah, I wrote about women's health.
Okay. So that was your unique angle.
Yeah, so I, I wrote about, um, and I can get into the specifics, but some of what I wrote about is a little personal, so I won't share that, but, um, I did write about how I, when I went to Catholic high school, uh, we did not have sex education at all. Um, and that was something that was very lacking in my life. And so when I came to college, then I started working in that clinic and I started to teach sex education to middle schools and high schools. Um, and then I also was a very strong proponent for, um, for STD testing. And I started that on my campus. I did like a free STD testing night for all Greek life, like every Thursday. Um, and then I also kind of related that back to being a doula and just like kind of the stigmatized issues in women's health. And, um, yeah, as a doula, I also supported women who had been sexually abused and things like that. So it was very an intense essay for sure. But, um, I don't know. I felt that some people say don't talk about controversial things in your essay. Don't talk about a specific specialty in your essay, uh, which is all of what I did. But at the end of the day, I wanted to pick a school who would accept me for that. You know, I didn't want to lie about that. That was such a big part of, of my life. So I wanted to, I wanted to address that and I think I was able to portray the highlight parts of my personality that I wanted to portray in my essay through those stories. Um, you know, be the change you want to see the world and all that, all that jazz.
More power to you for that. And I don't see why that's something that definitely why is that even controversial? Like it shouldn't be at all, but exactly. And I'm glad that you're rewriting the script on that and like making change every single day. And it starts with an essay. It starts with getting into a medical voice that people listen to. So you're going to do, I know you're, you've already done some really amazing work. I'm sitting here thinking like, that's so cool. I want to be a doula. So cool. So that's really inspiring, you know, you've already done so many amazing things and I just, I can tell, like, you're going to do a lot more, so that's exciting, um, you to scape the best answer ever to that. So our listeners today are going to kind of like walk away from this episode, getting a better idea of like, what are some important things to talk about to do? Like if you're still early in the stages, what to get involved in. And you know, I get questions about sometimes like this is a different topic where I'll get questions about like, should I incorporate religion into my essays? Um, no matter what religion they're part of. Like, I'm not sure if that will be received well, but you're right. Like if it's a part of like, if it's what makes you, who you are, have to talk about it,
But at the end of the day, I mean, this is the school you're going to go to. So you want to go to a school, that's going to accept you for that. You know, you can lie all you want in your application, but are you going to be in a place that's going to help you thrive? Probably not. If you're lying about everything, you know, you want to feel, you want to feel good about where you go, because at the end of the day, you're picking that school just as much as they're picking you. So I say be as honest as possible in what you're writing. Um, and to just do things because you want to do them not because you think it's going to look good, you know, just, but yeah, I definitely writing that to say, I know it can be hard. And I obviously, I didn't talk about any of the stuff that I talked about with you, but, um, I do actually help write or help with essay editing. So, uh, not right now, but, um, because of boards, but I, during the next application session. Yeah. I've been, that's something that I've been trying to help people with because I know it's really daunting and it's really hard, but, um, I just have an English background. So it helps me to view it in a lens of like, what's gonna make you the most that make this essay, the best piece of argumentative essay possible, you know,
Through, in mind for people that kind of reach out to me, I'll let you do your boards, but I know for next and the next cycle definitely keep you in mind. Um, so my next question for you is kind of just going more into your Instagram. So that's how I found out. I'm finding a lot of people lately and you know, you post some awesome pictures, really like pretty pictures. I like, um, I was wondering what inspired you to start
Well, so yeah, kind of pretty much everything that I've been talking about. I mean, coming from not really having anyone in the medical community and my family, um, everyone who I went to undergrad with who was pre-med dropped out. So like literally all my riends. Yeah. So I have probably, I think I have two friends from high school that are in medical school and I kind of, you know, I got kind of sick of peppering them with questions all the time, shout out to [inaudible]. But, um, yeah, so I, I formed the Instagram because I love the medical community. I think it's very, very supportive. I genuinely do not like Instagram. I think that it, it fosters a lot of, uh, negative things in society, but I think the medical Instagram community is, is an exception to that. And I that's like the only, yeah, that's the only thing that I really use Instagram for is for the medical community in that community there in that, um, everyone just like kind of really lift each other up and it's very helpful. I've loved so much of it. Um, and yeah, if I can pay it forward, then I absolutely will. I mean, and now that I'm doing this editing service, I'm, I'm doing it on donation basis. So just, you know, trying to help other people who are, who have been in the same boat and don't really have that many resources and don't have many people to turn to. I think it's just, it's just a great way to connect with people and to, to, uh, yeah. Just network and learn a lot about, I asked so many people from other DO schools, I've met a lot of people through it and just ask like what their experience has been like and recommendations and people who are, you know, in years above me, how they started with fours. And it's just, it's great. I love it. I think it's, it's the bright, the shining silver lining of Instagram.
It's so great that you use it for that too. And like you put yourself out there and you connect. Um, cause like I said, even before we started recording this podcast, I struggled to do that. I struggled to like get involved in a community. I was just shy even though like I was posting stuff, I didn't know how to talk to people or it'd be like, this is who I am. Like, I don't know how to make friends. I was just as scared to do that. But I'm so happy that, you know, this podcast is like a thing to help me do that. So like, for those of you listening, if you kind of struggled with the same thing, there are so many awesome, you know, pre-meds even, but also people in med school that are helping others, like talk, talking about applications, talking about like when MCAS comes out, when you should be submitting your applications and like that stuff, I didn't really know. I didn't even know DO schools like had their own AKOMAS until like pretty late in the whole process. I was just like, Oh, I have to like copy and paste everything into AKOMAS mass now. Okay. There's so many awesome people on social media now that are like sharing that and just get involved in that community. It's really going to help you in the long run. Yeah.
And it's great too, because it's not just medical students that I follow. I mean, I follow a lot of NPs PAs and that's something that I think is really beneficial and not every med school talks to you about interdisciplinary work. And so it's really nice to see what roles they have in pharmacy, students and dentists, things like that. I think it's really, it's really great to broaden your horizon that way. And I think it's just such a supportive community. I think it's great. I'm so happy to be a part of it. Yeah,
I started, yeah. I just started trying to like follow different, um, professions too. Like even pharmacists and PAs, like you were saying, and my school doesn't do too much. I think they, they wanted to do more interdisciplinary work, but then COVID happened. And I think second year was meant for that to now that COVID happened, we can't, but we had one zoom session, um, for an activity like with someone, with another student from the pharmacy school. And I was just so impressed by his knowledge like here I am like watching sketchy medical videos. And for those of you who don't know what sketchy is, it's like a cartoon based program that helps you memorize drugs and pharmacology like micro, all that stuff. So here I am like watching sketchy videos and that's where all my knowledge comes from. And this guy just knows everything about the drugs. And like, I don't think he watched sketchy. So I was just so impressed. Like there's so many smart people out there and I just, I'm so excited to work with them. Um, I'm just excited for that. So it definitely connects with all professions. That's good advice.
Yeah, definitely.
All right. We are at the last question for today's podcast episode one piece, I would ways that changed your life that you want to share with everyone today.
I don't know. I have no idea.
Like what's kind of something that like keeps you going or like lifts you up I guess.
Um, okay, fine. So, okay. So if, if anyone does follow my Instagram, they all know that I'm very into politics and very, um, outspoken about some of those things. And, um, it's, I think it's really easy to, to lose sight of bigger pictures sometimes. So for me, I think, and even in medical school, and even when you're dealing with certain patient populations or a certain, um, you know, nonadherent patients, non-compliant like non-compliant, but, um, I think so one of my favorite quotes I'll do that. Is that okay? Can I do a quote?
Yeah.
Okay. Um, we don't see the world as it is. We see it as we are. I think that that is a quote that I like to keep in mind when, um, you know, you, you interact with people who have different viewpoints on your own. I think it's really important. And you will encounter that in your career, whatever career you will end up pursuing that is right for you. It might be, um, a doctor. It might be something totally unrelated to the medical field, but I think it's applicable to everyone. I think it's really easy to blow off people who have a different experience than you, but I think instead try to try to view it instead of, um, through the lens that everyone has a different lived experience that you can learn from. And, um, she tried to understand where they're coming from and it also helps you to acknowledge your own biases. You know, I'm viewing the world through how my lived experience and through, you know, for some of you, it might be, um, more sheltered. And for me, I was definitely sheltered having gone to an all girls school, an all girls Catholic high school, and then going to a more liberal college, it definitely opened my eyes. And I saw that I was leading the world in a very sheltered bubble. So that's something that I always try to learn more about other people's experiences. And I think at the end of the day, it will help you to be about a provider to understand where your patients are coming from and why they might be nonadherent or noncompliant or whatever have you, but also helping you deal with, um, different personalities in medical school, um, and politics and literally anything. So that's one of my favorite quotes and I think it's just an important thing to keep in mind when you do face any sort of struggle with, um, human interaction,
Great. Any kind of interaction, whether it's in the pub or in the world, or even personal relationships relationships for sure. Yeah. I really liked that quote. I don't think I've heard that one before. I'm definitely going to try to remember that one and keep it in my book.
Yeah. I think it's, you know, I've loved psych too. Aside from women's health psych is something that I would definitely consider. And I think that it's definitely a psych quote. I mean, it's not it's from an author, but, um, I think it's, it's important to realize yeah. In relationships for sure. I'm just going to end it with that. I can talk about this for awhile, but.
It's the key secret to having a good one. Now we see things as we are, and only from our perspective and we can be a little bit, you know, close-minded sometimes so thanks much for sharing that that was really valuable advice. And I love that girl. So we are reaching the end of the episode. Thanks so much for having me today. I really love chatting with you because actually like a naturally much longer episode than my other ones, but it was a good thing.
Because I'm chatty, the social interaction during quarantine, especially. So thank you.
Yeah, no, me too. This is like saving my life right now for both of you guys who are listening. If you guys have enjoyed the podcast, make sure you hit subscribe. So you don't miss any new episodes released every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Also, if you've learned one little thing from the show, I would really appreciate it. If you could leave a rating and review, it means a lot to me and I read them all and make sure you guys follow Hailey on Instagram. Again, her handle is @busyscrubs. All right. I will see you in the next episode. Thanks for listening today.
Hey, welcome. This is episode 18. In this episode, I have the pleasure of interviewing Hailey. She is a second year student at an osteopathic medical school. I found her on Instagram, where she posts really great aesthetically pleasing photos and talks about her personal journey towards med school. Hailey has a great post on her Instagram @busyscrubs about her three gap years and all the things she did during that time that helped her grow personally and academically. Today, I'll be asking her a few questions to dive deeper into her application stats and why she wanted to become a doctor. Keep listening if you want some insight from admitted students. Hi Hayley. Thanks so much for joining me today. How are you?
No, I'm good. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah.
What are you up to?
Um, you know, just about to study renal, um, it's snowing outside. My cats are running around and sipping some coffee.
That sounds like it's coming out of a movie that sounds really like cozy.
It's the winter Wonderland over here.
It snowed once up where I am. Um, but it was light. It was just a couple of inches and it melted right after. So we're waiting for that next snow storm, I guess.
Yeah, it's definitely, I definitely am not going to be leaving my house, which is not a change. You know, I don't really leave my house much either.
I like try to go to the gym. I feel like that's the only thing that gets me out of the house when I do go. But yeah. Other than that, I don't really go out grocery shopping maybe.
Yeah, that is my big outing. I have my spin bikes. I'll find that I'll do anything. Grocery food. Food is the main motivator. But tell us a little bit about yourself. Where are you from? Who are you? Okay. Um, fun questions is always the question that I just read that during the medical school interview, who am I? I don't know. I don't know who I am. Um, so I'm Hailey. Um, I am originally from California, Los Angeles. Um, I went to an all-girls Catholic high school. I'm not Catholic, but I think it's a fun fact about me. Loved it. How'd you survive? I'm like it was, I thrived, it was great. Went there from seventh to 12th grade, very sheltered, but yeah. And then,um, I traveled to Northern California for college. I went to UC Davis, go ads. And, um, I majored in, I did a double major actually in English and genetics and genomics. And then, um, now I'm in medical school. Um, so that's a little bit about me. Um, I'm not going to reveal exactly where I go to medical school because my mom has made me somewhat paranoid of strangers on the internet. So I'm just going to,
Yeah, I'm always paranoid.
No, like I'm sure people can find out with some slew thing, but you know, whatever.
I'm so crazy about it because I listened to murder podcasts and that's probably why it's like always on my mind.
I'm like, it's like, what if weird sounds? Or like when I'm around my car, making sure the doors are locked, closing the blinds. It occupies my mind. So I totally get that. But, um, thanks so much for sharing some background. It's so cool that you're from LA. How did you like that growing up?
Um, I, I mean, I love California. It's crazy expensive. I actually, you know, don't hesitate to saying this, but I actually like Northern California more. Um, yeah. So, uh, after I graduated from UC Davis, I actually moved to San Francisco for a little bit and just, I love San Francisco, but LA it's hard because everything's really spread out. Um, I feel like versus San Francisco, the city everything's so central, it's, you know, it's kind of like a small, small town feel in a big city. Um, or I don't know if it's a big city, but I've never been to New York, so I know, but, um, yeah, LA is, it's very spread out. I love the beaches. I mean, you can't beat that. They're so beautiful, warm, and you can actually go in them. But, um, yeah, I just, I like the there's way more greenery in Northern California. Everyone was just really nice LA you kind of get the little bit of like the pretentious side aspects, but, um, it's home. So, you know,
I can’t wait to get out there one day. So, no, I can't wait to go, but I want to dive a little bit deeper into like your application, right. So I was very interested, um, in that post about, you know, your three gap years that you took. And a lot of people reach out to me asking about gap years and it seems like people are just now starting to kind of get used to that concept. And it's very normal to take time off, but I think it's scary for people cause you know, we're not used to it. We go to school like back to back our whole lives and then we get out of college and we're like, how are we supposed to take a gap year? Now we're just going to just go straight into med school. But it's not very common anymore to do that. So if you don't mind talking a little bit about how, like what motivated you to take those gap years, what mindset you had to even do that and like just some of your stats while applying, that would be great.
Yeah, of course. You know, I actually get that a lot too. Uh, I've gotten a lot of questions on Instagram. Direct message of like is like is 25 too old, you know? And I'm like, why, why is this a thing? You know, I think it's so American too, you know, in the US we always are just go, go, go, never take a break. And for me, I knew going into undergrad that I wanted to take gap years because your girl's going to be burned out. You know, I was, I was very go, go, go. in college. I had, I was working a ton of jobs and just constantly busy. So for me, I really, really wanted to take time off after, cause I knew that one starting medical school, I would just be, I would just be burnt out. So I wanted to in the time off make money, um, because it's expensive, uh, have opportunities that you probably won't get to have once you enter medical school, you know, because, um, you know, taking time to travel, things like that, once you're in medical school, it is very go, go go also. I mean, you go from medical school to your residency to actually, you know, your career. So for me, I wanted to take time to travel. I wanted to spend a lot of time with family. Um, and it just made the most sense to me. I wasn't really thinking about, Oh man, I'm going to be 30 something by the time I'm actually practicing. Um, that wasn't really an issue for me. I think, you know, you're going to be 30 anyway. What's, what's the difference. I think it's people always have their timeline, you know, well, I want to be doing this by the time I'm this age. And I just, I think do don't do what society expects of you. You know, if you think that you need to have your career done by the time you're 30 and or 25, um, who cares do what you want to do, if you think that you're going to be the most successful by taking time off and like getting to really experience life I say, go for it. I think the fact that I took time off has made me eventually I think will make me a better physician because I actually had some real-world experiences. I also think for people who, who, um, you know, don't get the opportunity to work much in college. I think it's an important thing that you do before you enter medical school. I think in medical school, it's very apparent that people who come straight from medical school and I'm not saying that's a bad thing at all, but I just think that you're, you know, you're a little more sheltered and you haven't seen for me, I know a lot about insurance. You know, I know a lot about, um, benefits, excuse me, and things like that. And I wouldn't have learned at all about that if it weren't for having worked after, after medical school and like being in the workforce. Um, and I don't know if that answers the question much, but I just, I don't think you need to concern yourself with a timeline. I don't understand what the stigma is. And I guess for me, when I'm ever questioning something, I'll do worst case scenario, you know? Okay. Worst case scenario. I take gap years. What's the pros of that. Oh, I get to breathe and relax for a second
Funny. Um, I really like that perspective and I think it's cool that you said exactly what, um, I interviewed someone named Sophia in episode 17 and she exactly the same thing. She was like, you're going to be 30 anyways. You're going to be 40 anyways. So might as well like be doing the thing you want to do at that age, no matter what stage you're in. And I love that advice. And I love that. You said you saw a lot of things while working, like you learned about insurance, you learned about what it's actually like to work in the space. Like I've done some volunteering. Yes. I've done some shadowing, but I even, I really don't know what it's going to be like day in to day out. I don't know what the pros are or the cons really are. I don't know the ins and outs at all. So I, I liked that. You said that and I wanted to ask you kind of piggy backing off of that. Do you feel like you said that people who kind of come straight out of college are a little bit more sheltered and there's nothing wrong with that, but it shows, so what's like one thing that you feel like people miss out on when they don't take some gap years before med school, other than just like some world experience?
What’s omething that you're not sheltered about anymore. Kind of.
Okay. Well, here's a big one. I think knowing that people have their own styles for doing things, and one thing is not necessarily better than the other. I think when you come from college or, you know, all you have experienced as college, um, you start to have stereotypes of like, Oh, people who don't go to class are, are slackers. You know? So in medical school, sometimes I had some people say, you know, Oh, so-and-so, doesn't go to class. Even though it's not mandatory, they're probably not doing well. And it's like, no, that's a very sheltered way of thinking. I mean, for some people studying at home is actually way more efficient use of their time. So that's just one little example, you know what I mean? It's like, yeah, you, people do things in their own way. And I don't know if that's necessarily a by-product of, of coming straight from college, but I have heard that multiple times from people who, who are younger and they just, you know, maybe have a specific worldview that hasn't been brought in by, by more, um, experiences.
But yeah, I think, and back to the age thing, I also think, I don't know. I think it's a veryUS thing to, to view it that way. I mean, 30 is not old. 25 is not old. Age is a mindset. You know, I don't know if I have a unique, a unique perspective in that because my parents happened to be older. I mean, my dad is 76 and he is spry. The man is spry. You know, like, I don't think age, age is just a number, you know, I think do whatever you want to do. And don't let that inhibit you. Especially when we have such long life expectancies in US. I don't think that 25 is old. So I think that that's something that you can also broaden a perspective on. There's nothing wrong with, with starting your career at 30.
No, you're right. And even, I, you know, I can take this advice and kind of internalize it. I feel like growing up, I definitely thought 25 was old. Like I'm just going to get, I know I was that person, like, I feel like my parents were always, so scared of getting older and older and they're young. Like they're only in their forties right now. I think, um, I think my dad actually, maybe they hit their fifties now, but, um, they they're, they're always like, Oh, we're getting old, we're getting old. So I always thought saw that as a bad thing. And I'm just going to be old. I want to just like be making like my living my life and have everything together by 30 at least. Cause that's old and then you're gonna have kids and then you're going to get, even if it's still lingering, I'm still trying to get over it. And like, not in like see past it, but I definitely still think about it. So I need to like, maybe-
I'm right there with you. It's hard to challenge. I mean, my sister's turning or my sister just turned 28 and it was like a weird thing for me. I was like, Whoa, you're 28. But it's like, what? You know, it's just ingrained in us in society too, to view it that way. And I don't think that, I think that's something that should be challenged, you know?
It definitely shouldn't be. Thanks for speaking to that. So what were your stats going into school? I know my listeners love to hear the stats.
Well, first of all, I'm going to say comparison is the thief of joy. Don't compare yourself. Everyone has their own different things that they bring to the table. Um,
I ask this question too, that I do want to preface that is because everyone has such different stats. And I think that helps people. And I wish, I wish I heard these stats like earlier in my application cycle. I wish I heard real stories of people who got in rather than just looking on MSAR and seeing five twenties. And I know, and I was just like, Oh my gosh, like, who am I to even like I apply to this school. I was like, they're going to just put my application in the trash. So it really stifled my confidence. And a lot of it was self like negative talk. Totally. But, um, that's why I asked because I've heard so many amazing stories. So far people like getting into med school, like putting everything they're all into these applications, whether they have really good GPA's or lower GPA's. So that's why that's some context as to why I asked for stuff.
No, that's a good point. And I had definitely been nervous too when I applied because I was basing it off of MSAR and all those things. And I even contemplating contemplated doing a postbac after afterwards, but I was like, Oh man, they're so expensive. So I kind of just, you know, shoot my shot. I think you should, if you have the means to, um, you know, maybe just apply to a couple of schools and see, um, if they're in your reach and just try before you pursue a post-bacc cause it is man, it is expensive.
Already like paying for college and take your med school, like this whole post-bac thing. Like I get why some people just have to do it to get their GPA's, but I'm just so against the price that comes with the schooling.
Yeah. And that's another thing that's made me disillusioned to the field is definitely how much of a business it has. Um, but anyway, y'all answered stops avoiding this button. Um, so
If you want to share that's totally up to you.
It's fine.
I don't mind. Um, my GPA after graduating, um, was a 3.5 and my cat was a 510. Um, and my GPA I think was what hindered me more. So I did a double major and um, so English and genetics. And so my English GPA was a 4.0, so I had a little, if you do the math, like I had a little bit of a lower end science GPA. So I think that that was, that was my hindrance a little bit more so, but I was able to make it up a bit with the MCAT.
I'm totally at your, no, honestly your stats are good. I, I, I would say that you're like five, like it's that cutoff Mark. We all talk about in terms of GPA, like where you want it to be. So those are good stats. So how, how many schools did you apply to?
Um, so I knew I wanted to do DO. Um, so I pretty much applied to all the DO schools cause it was the same app and it was really easy to just check off the check off the boxes. Yeah. Yeah. So I definitely love the, um, osteopathic principles. I really wanted to have that extra tool tool set and my toolbox. Um, I really wanted to stray away from the opioid epidemic and have, um, you know, a different way to manage pain. So I really, really liked DO and I was sold on it when I heard about it and especially wanting to potentially do women's health is something that's very applicable. I think if you, you know, maybe you want to do anesthesiology or something, radiology that it's more difficult to incorporate. I think I understand why someone would be swayed towards MD, but for me, I knew that I was going to want to use that in my practice. So I exclusively applied to DO schools. Um, well actually, no, that's not true. So I did apply to two MDs in California just because the location. And I was like, Oh, if I, so I went to like UCLA and UCS. So it was like
Are thereDO sells in California yet. Are there?
Here's two, but I didn't like the location. So there's Western in Southern California and then there's, uh, Toro and uh, in Vallejo, which is kind of close to where I was actually. But, um, yeah, and then I actually randomly fun fact applied to some schools in Australia. Um, yeah, so I love Australia and my boyfriend's actually from there. So we were, but then it was, it was kind of more like a, okay, this is worst case I'll, I'll go to university of Sydney or something, which is an amazing school, but also very far from family. But, uh, I would also have to marry my boyfriend. So that was kind of like an alert. They got it up. I was ready for that yet. So that was, uh, and it was also the whole application was free, which was awesome. Yeah. And they really didn't require much. I mean, it was, it was mostly stats. So it was like, what's your GPA? What was your, they wanted my high school transcript. They wanted my college transcript and they wanted my MCAT, but I didn't really need letters of rec. I didn't really need to put any essays and it was really easy. So I was like, yeah, why not? Let's do it. Like it's free.
So what made you choose, um, uh, sorry, actually, we're not going to talk about your location. I just realized that. So for that question, but, um, that's really, really great to hear. I'm so glad that everything worked out and, you know, you were laser focused on something and that helped too, which was osteopathic medical schools and the OMM. So how have you liked your own mem experience? You are a second year, so you've definitely got some good exposure. I'm sure.
Yeah. So, you know my school's very intense with, with OMT. Uh, we, we take it very seriously and I'm, I really, really like it. I think it's awesome. When, what you do, you can actually see what you're doing. I think first year it's a little bit harder because you're still kind of figuring out what it even means to palpate someone. Um, but I love it. I think, you know, there's definitely some days where I'm like, Oh, I just really want to study for my block course. I don't really want to study OMT right now. I would rather focus my time on studying for the boards or whatnot. But, um, overall I'm really glad for, for how intense my school has made it, especially during quarantine because a lot of schools kind of had to, you know, cancel a lot of their lab work and stuff like that, but still made it somewhat feasible. We had to just record ourselves doing techniques and you know, still stay on top of it. So I really enjoyed it so far. So I'm glad I'm happy with my decision.
That's awesome. My favorite, um, technique and OMM is HBLA, but it doesn't go away. Um, well the back one is cool for the back and that was the first one we learned. And that was the first time I was like super into OMM was like, this is cool because I'm not paying just from bad posture while. Yeah. And I was just like, Oh yeah, it's been hurting like here for like a couple of weeks now. And I'm just like waiting for it to go away. But my professor was like, all right. Yeah. Like, you know, I'll just do the HBLA on you for those of you guys who are listening, HBLA stands for high velocity, low amplitude. And it's basically the cracking method to like crack out the pain. So he did that on me and my pain went away and I was like, this is the coolest thing ever, but think I'm not good at it. I probably just more practice. I really tried. Um, but I'm not good at it. So how, how would you say like on a scale from one to 10, how good at it are you and how much practice do you put into it?
Oh, bad. Okay. Well, I practiced HBLA a lot actually, uh, with my best friend in med school, but, um, just because we were so bad at it, we were like, we need to practice. This is hard as intense anymore. Like cracking someone's back. So I don't want to be bad at it. So I'd say, okay, cervical HBLA no, I'm not good at that. And I'm also insanely terrified to crack someone's neck. Um, so got to practice that one more, but I love rib HBLA. Um, I think that it's a really easy one to do. It is hard because I'm tall. So they always pair me with like big men. So, you know, it's harder when you have like a big guy, you don't know how much exact force you're still trying to put, put on it. So, you know, there's definitely some, um, touch and go stuff. But when it comes to like working on like a small woman, it's easy. Um, but yeah, if I were to practice on some of my guy friends, it's, it's definitely can be a little discouraging, but I think my favorite methods are, uh, first of all, suboccipital release. That's like all the neck work.
I love it. It really works well.
That's amazing. I taught my boyfriend so he could do it on me.
Yeah, I love watching the video version. Hold on, let me move my chair. But I have basically that headboard my bathroom and I put my neck back on it to do my own suboccipital release. And there you go.
That's innovative. I like it. I know sometimes I'll like go through and diagnose myself, but I love sacrum and pelvis. I think that those are awesome. And I think that they're really, I mean, I have very, very tight hamstrings, so I, I sometimes like will sit there and diagnose myself in the seated position, a Cedar flection test. Yeah. And I'm like, you know, I, yeah. I could use some OMT right now. I think that would help fix all my problems.
Yeah. It's a really good tool to have in your job. I agree with that. Um, so another question I have for you is kind of diving more into, like, why did you want to become a doctor? I feel like that's a hard question for a lot of us to answer sometimes when we have to write essays. And although we kind of like, we kind of know why, but like, we don't really know how to talk about it. It's just such a hard question. So I was wondering if you would want to speak a little bit to like what you talked about, like what, what did you say for those essays? Why, why do you want to be a doctor?
Sure. Okay. Loaded question. Um, yeah, no, I think it is really hard to write about because for a lot of people, I mean, it's not just one answer, you know? Um, I have so many reasons why I chose this field, but I'm, I'm one of those weird people who said I wanted to be a doctor since I was like four years old. Um, I don't know what it was. So I think,
Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt, but I'm saying, I don't think that's weird. There's a lot of people that like have that story.
Yeah. I think for some people it really is a calling, you know, and you just, it's something that I always had in the back of my mind. You know, when, when teachers would ask, what do you want to be when you're older, I'd always be doctor. Um, but you know, throughout my life, I actively wanted to test that because it is a very vigorous path. So if there was something that would make me more happy, I was very, very willing to take it. So yeah. You know, throughout high school and college, I would do volunteering and did a ton of extracurriculars just to make sure that that was something that I was really sure about. Um, in high school I worked in a hospital, I actually hated it. I did not like working in a hospital. I thought it was like just very sterile. Uh, so that kind of made me nervous and then when I went into college, um, I did a lot of, a lot of different experiences. So I was a doula. Um, and I worked, I doula is someone who helps assist with, uh, women who are birthing. And, um, I also worked in 18 clinics, so it was kind of like the equivalent of planned Parenthood. Um, so I would dispense and pretty much see the patient throughout the entire visit. It was very hands-on. Um, I was basically like an MA and could dispense birth control and do counseling for, for things like that. Um, and I also worked in, uh, research to kind of question, cause I think epidemiology is really interesting. I love public health. Um, and did some, some lab, uh, some bench work to, to see if I liked that. I did not like that.
Um, and then I, uh, I didn't like bench lab work.
Yeah. Yeah. And then I, my first real taste of clinical work was when I went abroad and that was pretty much what solidified, okay. Yes. I love this. I love clinical work. I think that, that is definitely what really reassured me that I was on the right path. Um, but yeah, you know, I think I have a lot of different reasons why I decided to pursue doctor, because I mean, if you love clinical work, you could do a lot of other things. You could be a nurse could be a PA, you could do PT, you know, there's like a lot of stuff that you can do. Um, but so at the end of the day, you know, I have some very practical reasons and some more emotional reasons of why I chose it. But I think there this degree, mostly the most practical reason is this degree just incorporates all the things that I love. So I thought it would open the most doors for, for everything. So, you know, you have teaching, you can do research, you have leadership, um, branches into advocacy and policy, um, you know, helping people, obviously there's that satisfaction of actually seeing the change that you're making. And I think that that's a, that's a big thing, cause there's plenty of professionals who help people too. But for me, I wanted to actually see that what I was doing was, was helping someone in front of me, um, which is harder to say for some other professions. Um, there's the lifelong learning. Um, yeah, I think, I think I would have been happy at the end of the day with the different, you know, with maybe a PA or NP, but I definitely have the personality type of, I want to be the one who understands why we're doing what we're doing and understands the pathology and kind of like the, what, obviously I love like the teamwork that is in hospitals and not to say that NPs and PAs don't know that, but I just want it to have that extra training. Um, and I knew at the end of the day, I would have, if I had gone PA or NP would have eventually led me to, to get a medical degree. So I just thought, you know, just, let's just cut straight to it. It's just got that degree. Um, and then, you know, another, another reason that was practical, I wanted to be self-sufficient, you know, I think as a woman, I didn't want to be reliant on anyone else. Um, you know, a man or a husband in my life to be the one who supports me. I like that I'd be my own boss and I can, you know, be a part of that change for this field was very male dominated and it's nice too, to be a woman in that field, you know, and it's nice to be able to be self-sufficient. Um, and that's a whole nother topic. I know that it's definitely still a hurdle being a woman in this field, but, um, it does give me satisfaction, you know? Um, and yeah, I don't know. There's just so many reasons I, I liked that were needed. Our profession's always going to be something that is beneficial, especially now in COVID. We can definitely see that our jobs are very essential. Um, I think one of the most important things that this is a very long-winded answer, so yeah.
Got it. No, this is what I need. This is what everyone needs to hear.
So yeah, I, I, for me, I really, really wanted the challenge. I love that, um, obviously medical schools are very challenging. Um, but you know, I've, I've definitely always had an inclination for English, um, humanities. My whole family does no one in my family has science background. No one likes, no ones knows how to do math. No, I'm just kidding. No, we're all, it's like a very Favorite topic of my family, but, uh, we are very liberal arts spirit and my high school you've been, was very, very English dominated. We had Renaissance festivals every year. We were English nerds. Um, yeah, I mean, I had a 4.0 in English in college, so my English degree, I was in the English honors program. So obviously my natural inclination is more humanities related. Um, and you know, I did consider a career in law and a career as an English professor, but, um, I don't know. I thought that if I made something that was my passion into a career, I wouldn't like it as much. So I hopefully I'll still, you know, write a book or something someday, but I really liked that sciences were challenged for me and I wanted to prove to myself that I could do it. Um, so to anyone out there who is, you know, the sole person in their family pursuing this career, you can do it. I think it's, you know, it's definitely challenging. You don't have like, you know, maybe the same resources as other people, but I don't know. I think if you can challenge yourself and, um, you'll probably surprise yourself, but anyway, those are some of my reasons. Um, I actually didn't talk about any of them in my essay though.
How did you like, wait, what did you talk about?
This is why it's awkward. It's because everyone thinks like, I there's so many reasons why I need to be a doctor. How do I make that concise and fit it into an essay? But I think I had my English brain on when I was doing it. Um, and you know, at the end of the day, it is an essay, it's an argumentative essay. So for me, I thought, which of these, like, which obviously it's still very applicable and true to my story, but how am I going to talk about me being, you know, the, I don't know, I guess I could have related to me being the only person, I just didn't think it was going to make for a great essay. So I picked a topic that was a very clear theme for me throughout my education and, uh, throughout all my work that I did. And, um, I wrote about that because I thought that it would be the most unique, um, cause I think a lot of people write their essay and they're saying, you know, I want to help, I want to do this. I want to do that. And it's, it's very generic. So I picked something that I knew was true to me. Um, so yeah, I wrote about women's health.
Okay. So that was your unique angle.
Yeah, so I, I wrote about, um, and I can get into the specifics, but some of what I wrote about is a little personal, so I won't share that, but, um, I did write about how I, when I went to Catholic high school, uh, we did not have sex education at all. Um, and that was something that was very lacking in my life. And so when I came to college, then I started working in that clinic and I started to teach sex education to middle schools and high schools. Um, and then I also was a very strong proponent for, um, for STD testing. And I started that on my campus. I did like a free STD testing night for all Greek life, like every Thursday. Um, and then I also kind of related that back to being a doula and just like kind of the stigmatized issues in women's health. And, um, yeah, as a doula, I also supported women who had been sexually abused and things like that. So it was very an intense essay for sure. But, um, I don't know. I felt that some people say don't talk about controversial things in your essay. Don't talk about a specific specialty in your essay, uh, which is all of what I did. But at the end of the day, I wanted to pick a school who would accept me for that. You know, I didn't want to lie about that. That was such a big part of, of my life. So I wanted to, I wanted to address that and I think I was able to portray the highlight parts of my personality that I wanted to portray in my essay through those stories. Um, you know, be the change you want to see the world and all that, all that jazz.
More power to you for that. And I don't see why that's something that definitely why is that even controversial? Like it shouldn't be at all, but exactly. And I'm glad that you're rewriting the script on that and like making change every single day. And it starts with an essay. It starts with getting into a medical voice that people listen to. So you're going to do, I know you're, you've already done some really amazing work. I'm sitting here thinking like, that's so cool. I want to be a doula. So cool. So that's really inspiring, you know, you've already done so many amazing things and I just, I can tell, like, you're going to do a lot more, so that's exciting, um, you to scape the best answer ever to that. So our listeners today are going to kind of like walk away from this episode, getting a better idea of like, what are some important things to talk about to do? Like if you're still early in the stages, what to get involved in. And you know, I get questions about sometimes like this is a different topic where I'll get questions about like, should I incorporate religion into my essays? Um, no matter what religion they're part of. Like, I'm not sure if that will be received well, but you're right. Like if it's a part of like, if it's what makes you, who you are, have to talk about it,
But at the end of the day, I mean, this is the school you're going to go to. So you want to go to a school, that's going to accept you for that. You know, you can lie all you want in your application, but are you going to be in a place that's going to help you thrive? Probably not. If you're lying about everything, you know, you want to feel, you want to feel good about where you go, because at the end of the day, you're picking that school just as much as they're picking you. So I say be as honest as possible in what you're writing. Um, and to just do things because you want to do them not because you think it's going to look good, you know, just, but yeah, I definitely writing that to say, I know it can be hard. And I obviously, I didn't talk about any of the stuff that I talked about with you, but, um, I do actually help write or help with essay editing. So, uh, not right now, but, um, because of boards, but I, during the next application session. Yeah. I've been, that's something that I've been trying to help people with because I know it's really daunting and it's really hard, but, um, I just have an English background. So it helps me to view it in a lens of like, what's gonna make you the most that make this essay, the best piece of argumentative essay possible, you know,
Through, in mind for people that kind of reach out to me, I'll let you do your boards, but I know for next and the next cycle definitely keep you in mind. Um, so my next question for you is kind of just going more into your Instagram. So that's how I found out. I'm finding a lot of people lately and you know, you post some awesome pictures, really like pretty pictures. I like, um, I was wondering what inspired you to start
Well, so yeah, kind of pretty much everything that I've been talking about. I mean, coming from not really having anyone in the medical community and my family, um, everyone who I went to undergrad with who was pre-med dropped out. So like literally all my riends. Yeah. So I have probably, I think I have two friends from high school that are in medical school and I kind of, you know, I got kind of sick of peppering them with questions all the time, shout out to [inaudible]. But, um, yeah, so I, I formed the Instagram because I love the medical community. I think it's very, very supportive. I genuinely do not like Instagram. I think that it, it fosters a lot of, uh, negative things in society, but I think the medical Instagram community is, is an exception to that. And I that's like the only, yeah, that's the only thing that I really use Instagram for is for the medical community in that community there in that, um, everyone just like kind of really lift each other up and it's very helpful. I've loved so much of it. Um, and yeah, if I can pay it forward, then I absolutely will. I mean, and now that I'm doing this editing service, I'm, I'm doing it on donation basis. So just, you know, trying to help other people who are, who have been in the same boat and don't really have that many resources and don't have many people to turn to. I think it's just, it's just a great way to connect with people and to, to, uh, yeah. Just network and learn a lot about, I asked so many people from other DO schools, I've met a lot of people through it and just ask like what their experience has been like and recommendations and people who are, you know, in years above me, how they started with fours. And it's just, it's great. I love it. I think it's, it's the bright, the shining silver lining of Instagram.
It's so great that you use it for that too. And like you put yourself out there and you connect. Um, cause like I said, even before we started recording this podcast, I struggled to do that. I struggled to like get involved in a community. I was just shy even though like I was posting stuff, I didn't know how to talk to people or it'd be like, this is who I am. Like, I don't know how to make friends. I was just as scared to do that. But I'm so happy that, you know, this podcast is like a thing to help me do that. So like, for those of you listening, if you kind of struggled with the same thing, there are so many awesome, you know, pre-meds even, but also people in med school that are helping others, like talk, talking about applications, talking about like when MCAS comes out, when you should be submitting your applications and like that stuff, I didn't really know. I didn't even know DO schools like had their own AKOMAS until like pretty late in the whole process. I was just like, Oh, I have to like copy and paste everything into AKOMAS mass now. Okay. There's so many awesome people on social media now that are like sharing that and just get involved in that community. It's really going to help you in the long run. Yeah.
And it's great too, because it's not just medical students that I follow. I mean, I follow a lot of NPs PAs and that's something that I think is really beneficial and not every med school talks to you about interdisciplinary work. And so it's really nice to see what roles they have in pharmacy, students and dentists, things like that. I think it's really, it's really great to broaden your horizon that way. And I think it's just such a supportive community. I think it's great. I'm so happy to be a part of it. Yeah,
I started, yeah. I just started trying to like follow different, um, professions too. Like even pharmacists and PAs, like you were saying, and my school doesn't do too much. I think they, they wanted to do more interdisciplinary work, but then COVID happened. And I think second year was meant for that to now that COVID happened, we can't, but we had one zoom session, um, for an activity like with someone, with another student from the pharmacy school. And I was just so impressed by his knowledge like here I am like watching sketchy medical videos. And for those of you who don't know what sketchy is, it's like a cartoon based program that helps you memorize drugs and pharmacology like micro, all that stuff. So here I am like watching sketchy videos and that's where all my knowledge comes from. And this guy just knows everything about the drugs. And like, I don't think he watched sketchy. So I was just so impressed. Like there's so many smart people out there and I just, I'm so excited to work with them. Um, I'm just excited for that. So it definitely connects with all professions. That's good advice.
Yeah, definitely.
All right. We are at the last question for today's podcast episode one piece, I would ways that changed your life that you want to share with everyone today.
I don't know. I have no idea.
Like what's kind of something that like keeps you going or like lifts you up I guess.
Um, okay, fine. So, okay. So if, if anyone does follow my Instagram, they all know that I'm very into politics and very, um, outspoken about some of those things. And, um, it's, I think it's really easy to, to lose sight of bigger pictures sometimes. So for me, I think, and even in medical school, and even when you're dealing with certain patient populations or a certain, um, you know, nonadherent patients, non-compliant like non-compliant, but, um, I think so one of my favorite quotes I'll do that. Is that okay? Can I do a quote?
Yeah.
Okay. Um, we don't see the world as it is. We see it as we are. I think that that is a quote that I like to keep in mind when, um, you know, you, you interact with people who have different viewpoints on your own. I think it's really important. And you will encounter that in your career, whatever career you will end up pursuing that is right for you. It might be, um, a doctor. It might be something totally unrelated to the medical field, but I think it's applicable to everyone. I think it's really easy to blow off people who have a different experience than you, but I think instead try to try to view it instead of, um, through the lens that everyone has a different lived experience that you can learn from. And, um, she tried to understand where they're coming from and it also helps you to acknowledge your own biases. You know, I'm viewing the world through how my lived experience and through, you know, for some of you, it might be, um, more sheltered. And for me, I was definitely sheltered having gone to an all girls school, an all girls Catholic high school, and then going to a more liberal college, it definitely opened my eyes. And I saw that I was leading the world in a very sheltered bubble. So that's something that I always try to learn more about other people's experiences. And I think at the end of the day, it will help you to be about a provider to understand where your patients are coming from and why they might be nonadherent or noncompliant or whatever have you, but also helping you deal with, um, different personalities in medical school, um, and politics and literally anything. So that's one of my favorite quotes and I think it's just an important thing to keep in mind when you do face any sort of struggle with, um, human interaction,
Great. Any kind of interaction, whether it's in the pub or in the world, or even personal relationships relationships for sure. Yeah. I really liked that quote. I don't think I've heard that one before. I'm definitely going to try to remember that one and keep it in my book.
Yeah. I think it's, you know, I've loved psych too. Aside from women's health psych is something that I would definitely consider. And I think that it's definitely a psych quote. I mean, it's not it's from an author, but, um, I think it's, it's important to realize yeah. In relationships for sure. I'm just going to end it with that. I can talk about this for awhile, but.
It's the key secret to having a good one. Now we see things as we are, and only from our perspective and we can be a little bit, you know, close-minded sometimes so thanks much for sharing that that was really valuable advice. And I love that girl. So we are reaching the end of the episode. Thanks so much for having me today. I really love chatting with you because actually like a naturally much longer episode than my other ones, but it was a good thing.
Because I'm chatty, the social interaction during quarantine, especially. So thank you.
Yeah, no, me too. This is like saving my life right now for both of you guys who are listening. If you guys have enjoyed the podcast, make sure you hit subscribe. So you don't miss any new episodes released every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Also, if you've learned one little thing from the show, I would really appreciate it. If you could leave a rating and review, it means a lot to me and I read them all and make sure you guys follow Hailey on Instagram. Again, her handle is @busyscrubs. All right. I will see you in the next episode. Thanks for listening today.
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